Thread: Tuition bill targets immigrants

Jhaerlyn, welcome, new member!

I was a carpenter for 20 years before becoming an IBM programmer and I can tell you that after going through a 4 year apprenticeship for Carpentry, it hasn't payed off. In 1983, union wage in S Fla paid 11.83 / hour. In 1997, right before I made a career change, wages for a carpenter were no better than 13.00 an hour. Some carpenters around the country would laugh about that, sadly enough, I would have to agree. During those years, S Fla had seen alot of immigration from Cuba. But because of our country's on-going policies regarding the Cuban migration, my wages were held down by the Cuban immigrants coming into S Fla and working for less. Our current policy is that if a cuban can 'touch' our soil, then he/she is free to stay.

Well, the Mexican's look at that and say "Why can't I do that?" In fact, anyone coming in here illegally probably takes the same attitude. Since these people are working for peanuts, it puts a strain on the standard of living you and I are used to.

William is absolutely right when he says asks if you think that if the manufacturers of goods and services are going to pass the savings gained from employing illegal immigrants back down to the consumer. Heck no, and they never will.

I have a question for you. Do you think once our refineries and oil rigs in the Gulf are back on line, will the cost of gas come back down? You'd be foolish to think so. The American corporate mindset towards profit is 'do anything you can do to make a buck, even if it means selling out your mother'. If it wasn't just that, then you would see the cost of living less than what it is.

Like Leagal Citizen said, this isn't about the cost of a tomato, it's about legality. The 'cost' part will take care of itself, when we finally enforce our EXISTING IMMIGRATION LAWS and start looking out for own fellow Americans, instead of looking out for illegal immigrants. They're looking for cheaper labor so that they can compete with China's sweatshops, which should also be illegal.

Ok, lets look at legality.

I agree that they are breaking the law. What I'm pointing out however, is that you are either saying all lawbreaking is the same and should all be treated as heinous crimes OR you are saying that breaking the laws of immigration should be a crime that is a TOP priority to our government, and should be prosecuted at a very high level, like treason.

And it's both of those that I disagree with. or Rather I disagree with how you see the problem and therefore the solutions to the problem that you offer.

now, by the standards of the first view we'd all be in big trouble. ... some of you complained that I don't seem to understand the Illegal part of it all ... but the fact is I do ... But I also understand that it is AGAINST the law To drive 45 miles an hour through a school zone, and there by endangering the lives of children. However, i see no one up in arms about having the federal government or State government spend millions of dollars in catching speeders, especially in school zones ...despite how many children are hurt or even killed every year because of it.

That's just an example ...but by the first attitude a person caught speeding in through a school zone should justly have their liscence removed, and a court date set to see how much jail time they should serve.

The other is a bit more ... complex .... it recognizes that all laws aren't the same .... but it considers the act of ignoring our policy an act of agression against the people of the United states ...

To that ...all I can say is that it is the Price the Roman's pay for living in Rome. You can either deal with it in a way that makes you greater and stronger .... or you fail and are overwhelmed and implode.

As a teacher in an afluent Middle School ... i'd say things look grim ... people in the US are becoming soft, mentally, physically and spiritually ... we have become so self-centered that we are more concerned over trivial news about a favorite actor/actress than with what is really going on in the world around us ...


Here's a Question for you ? How does a man in Guatemala aquire legal permission to enter this country? ... I wonder how many of you know this ... if not guatemala ...any South American country...

QUOTE:
As a teacher in an afluent Middle School ... i'd say things look grim ... people in the US are becoming soft, mentally, physically and spiritually ... we have become so self-centered that we are more concerned over trivial news about a favorite actor/actress than with what is really going on in the world around us ...

VERY observant, Teach. In fact, if all Americans would turn off the TV there wouldn't be a single illegal alien in America. Private Bush would be upholding his Oath of Office too.

Why don't you start a movement to get Amercia to turn off the TV ? You could call it, "Simon says, Turn It Off !"

Originally Posted by Jhaerlyn

But I also understand that it is AGAINST the law To drive 45 miles an hour through a school zone, and there by endangering the lives of children. However, i see no one up in arms about having the federal government or State government spend millions of dollars in catching speeders, especially in school zones ...despite how many children are hurt or even killed every year because of it.

I don't see this as a valid comparison since the number of children killed or hurt in a school zone is very small in comparison to illegal immigrants entering the country. Also how many of the children are at fault for getting hit by running across the street in front of a car without looking, jaywalking, or other circumstances beyond anyone's control. The reason no one is up in arms is because they realize accidents can happen from human error regardless of how much you spend on safety, but they would be up in arms if the child was killed out of negligence. I really don't see the point you're trying to make with the example.

Originally Posted by Brian503a

Originally Posted by Jhaerlyn

But I also understand that it is AGAINST the law To drive 45 miles an hour through a school zone, and there by endangering the lives of children. However, i see no one up in arms about having the federal government or State government spend millions of dollars in catching speeders, especially in school zones ...despite how many children are hurt or even killed every year because of it.

I don't see this as a valid comparison since the number of children killed or hurt in a school zone is very small in comparison to illegal immigrants entering the country. Also how many of the children are at fault for getting hit by running across the street in front of a car without looking, jaywalking, or other circumstances beyond anyone's control. The reason no one is up in arms is because they realize accidents can happen from human error regardless of how much you spend on safety, but they would be up in arms if the child was killed out of negligence. I really don't see the point you're trying to make with the example.

In my county there is an officer at every school zone in the morning and in the afternoon. we have no problems with speeders in school zones.


Illegal immigrantions cost my state a heck of a lot more than school zone speeding.

I agree that they are breaking the law. What I'm pointing out however, is that you are either saying all lawbreaking is the same and should all be treated as heinous crimes OR you are saying that breaking the laws of immigration should be a crime that is a TOP priority to our government, and should be prosecuted at a very high level, like treason.

I don't think that we are saying that all lawbreaking is the same. We are aksing that existing immigration laws be enforce like all other laws. Personally, I don't want illegals prosecuted just for entering the country illegally, I just want them deported.

Here's a Question for you ? How does a man in Guatemala aquire legal permission to enter this country? ... I wonder how many of you know this ... if not guatemala ...any South American country...

Sec. 211. [8 U.S.C. 1181]

(a) Except as provided in subsection (b) and subsection (c) no immigrant shall be admitted into the United States unless at the time of application for admission he (1) has a valid unexpired immigrant visa or was born subsequent to the issuance of such visa of the accompanying parent, and (2) presents a valid unexpired passport or other suitable travel document, or document of identity and nationality, if such document is required under the regulations issued by the Attorney General. With respect to immigrants to be admitted under quotas of quota areas prior to June 30, 1968, no immigrant visa shall be deemed valid unless the immigrant is properly chargeable to the quota area under the quota of which the visa is issued.

(b) Notwithstanding the provisions of section 212(a)(7)(A) of this Act in such cases or in such classes of cases and under such conditions as may be by regulations prescribed, returning resident immigrants, defined in section 101(a)(27)(A), who are otherwise admissible may be readmitted to the United States by the Attorney General in his discretion without being required to obtain a passport, immigrant visa, reentry permit or other documentation.

(c) The provisions of subsection (a) shall not apply to an alien whom the Attorney General admits to the United States under section 207.

Maybe....go to the US Embassy with legitimate paperwork and passport and apply for a visa???

[/quote]As a teacher in an afluent Middle School ... i'd say things look grim ... people in the US are becoming soft, mentally, physically and spiritually ... we have become so self-centered that we are more concerned over trivial news about a favorite actor/actress than with what is really going on in the world around us ...

I thought we were all here because we DO know what's going on in the country around us.

Here's a Question for you ? How does a man in Guatemala aquire legal permission to enter this country? ... I wonder how many of you know this ... if not guatemala ...any South American country...

Here's my answer for you.....I could care less.

I have no idea what you teach in your "afluent" middle school (hopefully not spelling) but I feel sure you're over-qualified. You'd probably be able to defend a dissertation on idiocy.

Got my quotes mixed up again folks. Guess everybody's figured out I don't teach anything dealing with computers.