Thread: FairTax and Trade

Originally Posted by jtdc

That's the problem, they are the only cure!

And they will be in charge of setting rates for any FairTax!

The opportunities, from the manufacturer or importer, through the distribution network to the retailer, for a black market are tremendous. And the profit from such a black market would be an irresistible opportunity. And illegal aliens as well as legal citizens will be looking for bargains. How blind you are!

Or steal someone's ID!

YOU DO NEED A TAXPAYER ID!

Anyone can get a Tax Identification Number from the IRS. All you do is call up and ask for one.

The opportunities, from the manufacturer or importer, through the distribution network to the retailer, for a black market are tremendous. And the profit from such a black market would be an irresistible opportunity. And illegal aliens as well as legal citizens will be looking for bargains. How blind you are!

There is no opportunity for a black market between the manufacturer, importer and the retailer. No tax is owed by the manufacturer or distributor or importer or retailer. Consumers owe the tax and only consumers pay it at the retail final point of sale. All business to business transactions are exempt from the FairTax. Only the retailer collects the FairTax because it's only due at the final retail point of sale, and forwards their collections to the state if their state signs up to collect it with their state sales taxes or in the 5 states who don't now have a sales tax collection organization, then they can contract with a neighboring state to do it for them or the feds will set up shop in their state and do it for them. Both the retailer and the states who decide to collect are each paid a fee based on 1/4 of 1% of the FairTax they collected.

You don't need to steal a SS ID to file an income tax return. You need an SS number to get a driver's license in most states, and get a job with most employers.

You are so desperately against a Fabulous FairTax for no valid or coherent reason at all, after 27 pages, and wracking your weak little minds for 9 days, you still haven't come up with one good reason to oppose it.

You're like heroin addicts on Oxy, addicted to that income tax. DemoQuacks are addicted to the income tax. It's strange to see "conservatives" working so hard to preserve a tax system that rewards importers and illegal aliens at the expense of Americans, and hasn't once in its 105 year history ever paid the bills, not once, not even when they thought Clinton had balanced the budget, he hadn't. That was based on "projections" that didn't come to fruition.

The FairTax funds the government, robustly funds SS and Medicare, penalizes illegal aliens and importers, frees Americans who aren't "retailers" which is the very vast portion of us from any federal tax paperwork obligations of any kind, restores liberty of choice, freedom to spend, invest and save without tax implications, Rebates the tax to Americans and Legal Immigrants for necessities up to a limit. It shuts down all these phony 501 C 3 "charity" frauds we compete with every day on immigration and trade. It's just beautiful.

It's the best tax and economic development legislation ever presented to the American People.

The only question is are Americans still smart enough to grab it and pass it, and I think yes, as soon as we have enough Republicans in Congress to do so. We don't need a lot more, but a few more and then under Trump, the FairTax will become the law of our land solving so many of our problems every day of every week of every month of every year, in due course, by the numbers, without fuss or muss, without international disputes, without WTO, without lawsuits, without trade agreements, without confrontation.

Originally Posted by Judy

Anyone can get a Tax Identification Number from the IRS. All you do is call up and ask for one.

And that's our government's fault for allowing that!

Originally Posted by Judy

There is no opportunity for a black market between the manufacturer, importer and the retailer. No tax is owed by the manufacturer or distributor or importer or retailer.

That's why it is so ripe for black marketeering. When taxes were raised on cigarettes, truckloads were hijacked. People would buy from the black market because they could get their smokes for less than half the legal costs.

With this tax, manufacturers could certainly increase their profits by selling out the back door. And it would be easy to get away with it because there is no IRS auditing their income and expenses.

Further down the line, any distributor could sell a truckload to a blackmarketeer and make an untracked profit.

And an illegal alien would love to get that discount, as well as many legal citizens and aliens.

So it would create a new crime cartel.

Originally Posted by Judy

Consumers owe the tax and only consumers pay it at the retail final point of sale.

If they purchase from a legitimate retailer. You are either playing ignorant, or you are!

Originally Posted by Judy

All business to business transactions are exempt from the FairTax.

Correct! So they are off the books. No one is watching them if they sell to some illegal syndicate. So easy to get around your sales tax.

Originally Posted by Judy

Only the retailer collects, and forwards their collections to the state if they sign up to collect it with their state sales taxes or in the 5 states who don't now have a sales tax collection organization, then they can contract with a neighboring state to do it for them or the feds will set up shop in their state and do it for them. Both the retailer and the states who decide to collect are paid a fee based on 1/4 of 1% of the FairTax they collected.

But those entities get nothing from blackmarketeers. And those people buying from black markets can receive their Rebates like the people who are paying the tax, so criminals are being subsidized by the FairTax. Then, the FairTax rate would have to be raise to cover the loss, on the backs of the people who believed it would be cheaper than Income Tax!

Originally Posted by Judy

You don't need to steal a SS ID to file an income tax return.

So why do so many illegal aliens steal somebody's ID? Nothing will change there with the FairTax!

Originally Posted by Judy

It's strange to see "conservatives" working so hard to preserve a tax system that rewards importers and illegal aliens at the expense of Americans, and hasn't once in its 105 year history every paid the bills, not once, not even when they thought Clinton had balanced the budget, he hadn't.

The FairTax is supposedly calculated to collect the same amount of revenue that the Income Tax currently does. So, unless the rate is raised, which Congress will be able to do at it's whim, it will accomplish none of what you claim!

Originally Posted by Judy

That was based on "projections" that didn't come to fruition.

Just like your many claims of what the FairTax would do are just projections that will not come to fruition!

Originally Posted by Judy

The FairTax funds the government, robustly funds SS and Medicare, penalizes illegal aliens and importers

WRONG AGAIN! ANOTHER FALSE CLAIM AS IT IS RATED TO EQUAL THE TAXES IT IS REPLACING. IT CURES NOTHING!

Originally Posted by Judy

frees Americans who aren't "retailers" which is the very vast portion of us from any federal tax paperwork obligations of any kind

Unless you want the Rebate or sell something!

Originally Posted by Judy

restores liberty of choice, freedom to spend, invest and save without tax implications

Especially if you evade paying the tax by buying from the newly created, robust black market!

Originally Posted by Judy

Rebates the tax to Americans and Legal Immigrants for necessities up to a limit.

Whether they need it or not!

Originally Posted by Judy

The only question is are Americans still smart enough to grab it and pass it

Not if they recognize the Snake-Oil that it is!

Originally Posted by Judy

There is no opportunity for a black market ...

With a 23 percent tax, you bet there is opportunity for a black market. Foreign made products will flood into our country without detection and be sold in the underground economy.

Stop making crap up.


JWK

What underground economy? Where is this underground economy? Does anyone besides you, MW and jtdc know about it? Have you been there, do you buy stuff there? I've lived in 4 states, worked in 20 states and have never seen this "underground economy"? I see knock-offs on the streets of New York selling fake stuff. But that's hardly an "underground economy", any NYPD officer can shut them down in 3 seconds if they wanted to.

The importer doesn't pay the FairTax. The sellers on the sidewalk collect the FairTax from consumers. Any law enforcement in New York can check their sales receipts on the spot. They have to have a permit to get the rights to sell on the streets as a vendor to begin with. Very easy to ensure the FairTax is collected properly. And I would hardly call the "streets of New York" an "underground economy".

You guys don't understand how the Fairtax works, who is actually responsible for paying for it, how it impacts our economy, the many problems it solves, how easy it is, how truly Fabulous the FairTax is for all Americans, American Workers and American Businesses.

On one hand, it so funny to me, but on the other it's sad to see these grand displays of such desperate ignorance. It's why our Founders made the USA a Republicn instead of a democracy. Thank God for them.

Originally Posted by jtdc

And that's our government's fault for allowing that!

That's why it is so ripe for black marketeering. When taxes were raised on cigarettes, truckloads were hijacked. People would buy from the black market because they could get their smokes for less than half the legal costs.

With this tax, manufacturers could certainly increase their profits by selling out the back door. And it would be easy to get away with it because there is no IRS auditing their income and expenses.

Further down the line, any distributor could sell a truckload to a blackmarketeer and make an untracked profit.

And an illegal alien would love to get that discount, as well as many legal citizens and aliens.

So it would create a new crime cartel.

If they purchase from a legitimate retailer. You are either playing ignorant, or you are!

Correct! So they are off the books. No one is watching them if they sell to some illegal syndicate. So easy to get around your sales tax.

But those entities get nothing from blackmarketeers. And those people buying from black markets can receive their Rebates like the people who are paying the tax, so criminals are being subsidized by the FairTax. Then, the FairTax rate would have to be raise to cover the loss, on the backs of the people who believed it would be cheaper than Income Tax!

So why do so many illegal aliens steal somebody's ID? Nothing will change there with the FairTax!

The FairTax is supposedly calculated to collect the same amount of revenue that the Income Tax currently does. So, unless the rate is raised, which Congress will be able to do at it's whim, it will accomplish none of what you claim!

Just like your many claims of what the FairTax would do are just projections that will not come to fruition!

WRONG AGAIN! ANOTHER FALSE CLAIM AS IT IS RATED TO EQUAL THE TAXES IT IS REPLACING. IT CURES NOTHING!

Unless you want the Rebate or sell something!

Especially if you evade paying the tax by buying from the newly created, robust black market!

Whether they need it or not!

Not if they recognize the Snake-Oil that it is!

What claims will not come to fruition? You don't think taxing imports will reduce imports? Is Trump wrong about tariffs? You don't think taxing illegal aliens instead of handing them tax refund welfare will curb illegal immigration?

Further down the line, any distributor could sell a truckload to a blackmarketeer and make an untracked profit.

The FairTax doesn't track profit. There is no FairTax on profit. There is no profit to "track", so there is no "untracked profit" with the FairTax.

WRONG AGAIN! ANOTHER FALSE CLAIM AS IT IS RATED TO EQUAL THE TAXES IT IS REPLACING. IT CURES NOTHING!

No, the FairTax is not "rated" to replace the taxes it's eliminating. It was rated to do that in 1999 when income tax rates were much higher, before the Bush tax cuts and these last rounds of income tax cuts, which resulted in big deficits both times.

The FairTax rate hasn't changed, it's still 23% just as it was in 1999, the one year we almost balanced the budget, but it is not revenue neutral any more, it's much more revenue now, much, much more. See, you read something some Anti-FairTax fraud wrote a decade ago, but you don't know enough about the subject matter of taxation and economics to understand you're lost in the deep abyss of desperate ignorance of both taxation and economics as well as current events.

It's fascinating to watch and see, but it's sad also.

I don't know anything about Fair Tax and all this thread so I'm staying out of it.

Just trying to read and learn both sides.

I just hope whatever is passed is for the good of the American people and not foreigners!

I am sick of getting ripped off by the World and our own politicians

Then you will love the FairTax, Beezer, because among many other good things it does for our country, it taxes all imports sold in the US at 23% on top of any tariffs and forces illegal aliens in our country to pay a 23% FairTax on all new goods and services they purchase without offset, where Americans have the option for a Rebate that exempts necessities up to a certain amount. Plus it shuts down the ACLU, the SPLC, National Council of La Raza and every other 501C 3 "charity" fraud outfit, because under the FairTax, they're treated like every other business.

The FairTax is America First and Americans First.

Originally Posted by Judy

What underground economy? Where is this underground economy? Does anyone besides you,.

Here is a full repot on THE UNDERGROUND ECONOMY


regards,

JWK

1979 income tax evasion 40 years ago? Oh, so the "underground economy" is something that developed under the INCOME TAX.

Originally Posted by Judy

1979 income tax evasion 40 years ago? Oh, so the "underground economy" is something that developed under the INCOME TAX.

You just can't admit something when your wrong or know nothing about.


See: How Big Is the Underground Economy in America?

2016



Despite the inherent difficulties involved in such measurement, economists have attempted to calculate the size of shadow economies. One such economist, Friedrich Schneider, estimated that the size of the U.S. underground economy (not including criminal activity such as drug dealing etc.) relative to GDP was 7.2% in 2007, which was below the OECD average of 13.9%.



A 23 percent tax would encourage the underground economy to expand dramatically.


JWK