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Thread: Barack Obama's citizenship questioned

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  1. #191
    Senior Member BetsyRoss's Avatar
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    I have given birth 4 times and at no time was I ever called upon to write anything on the hospital record. It was done by interviewing me while I was still in the hospital immediately after the birth. Had I given birth elsewhere, the interview would not have taken place in my hospital room, unless it was an emergency and I was rushed to the hospital, just not quite in time. Which would still indicate a birth in the United States. Hospitals know when someone has given birth within their precints - or not. You have to be admitted and your presence recorded. I do not believe Obama's mother could have faked a Hawaiian hospital birth, based on my own (and other's) childbirth experience.
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  2. #192
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    As Obama Snr. so often publicly said, "An wuod Akumu Nyanjoga kod Sarah Ogwel" ("I am the son of Akumu Nyanjoga and Sarah Ogwel.")
    Got a source for all those often public statements? Perhaps in Kenya you are the child of your father's numerous wives, the same way the children of the fundamentalist polygamist Mormons belong to the community.
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  3. #193
    Senior Member MinutemanCDC_SC's Avatar
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    I wrote, "As Obama Snr. so often publicly said,
    'An wuod Akumu Nyanjoga kod Sarah Ogwel'
    ('I am the son of Akumu Nyanjoga and Sarah Ogwel')."


    Quote Originally Posted by vortex
    Got a source for all those often public statements? Perhaps in Kenya you are the child of your father's numerous wives, the same way the children of the fundamentalist polygamist Mormons belong to the community.
    I apologize for not including sources. Researching into the wee hours causes lack of attention to footnotes.

    http://www.misterseed.com/IKONININOVone2008.html

    http://www.eastandard.net/agriculture/InsidePage.php?id=1143998542&cid=4&

    Quote Originally Posted by vortex
    Perhaps in Kenya you are the child of your father's numerous wives...
    Perhaps, or else Barack Snr, consummate politician that he was, liked to invoke familial ties with Mama Sarah's Ogwel family as well as his Nyanjoga family ties through his biological mother, Akumu Nyanjoga Obama.
    Last edited by MinutemanCDC_SC; 07-22-2013 at 01:19 PM.
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  4. #194
    Senior Member MinutemanCDC_SC's Avatar
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    BetsyRoss, I am a friend, not a stranger. We are on the same team, not opponents. I refuse to originate "friendly fire," intentional or unintentional.

    We have only Stanley Ann (Dunham) Obama's word, [or most likely, her mother's word,] spoken to the interviewer typing the long form Certificate of Live Birth, as to her choice of a birthplace for baby Barack Obama II . . .


    Quote Originally Posted by MinutemanCDC_SC
    unless it was filled out by either of the two Honolulu hospitals...
    Unless the birthing hospital filled out the long form Certificate of Live Birth...
    Unless, of course, her baby's long form Certificate of Live Birth has the name and location of the hospital and the signature of the attending physician.
    If and only if none of the above "unless" clauses apply, then, on Barack Obama II's long form Certificate of Live Birth, [the mother's] "County and State or Foreign Country" in box 7c. originated with his mother.

    In the absence of a hospital birth, in Hawaii, the place of birth on the long form Certificate is whatever fact or fiction she chose for her new baby.
    Last edited by MinutemanCDC_SC; 07-22-2013 at 01:29 PM.
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  5. #195
    Senior Member BetsyRoss's Avatar
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    Well, because of having given birth in America, I cannot imagine, try as I might, her either a) doing such a thing, or b) getting away with it. If she did, then his birth documentation says 'Hawaii' and I can see no basis at this time for challenging that at this late date, other than that many people are suspicious of him for a variety of reasons. Many people still seem to think that some simple thing is going to make his presidency go away, and I just don't see how that can happen.
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  6. #196
    Senior Member azwreath's Avatar
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    [quote=MinutemanCDC_SC]BetsyRoss, I am a friend, not a stranger. We are on the same team, not opponents. I refuse to originate "friendly fire," intentional or unintentional.

    We have only Stanley Ann (Dunham) Obama's word, spoken to the interviewer typing the long form Certificate of Live Birth, as to her choice of a birthplace for baby Barack Obama II . . .
    Quote Originally Posted by "MinutemanCDC_SC":2bsfdt1n
    unless it was filled out by either of the two Honolulu hospitals...
    Unless the birthing hospital filled out the long form Certificate of Live Birth...
    Unless, of course, her baby's long form Certificate of Live Birth has the name and location of the hospital and the signature of the attending physician.
    If and only if none of the above "unless" clauses apply, then, on Barack Obama II's long form Certificate of Live Birth, "County and State or Foreign Country" in box 7c. originated with his mother.

    In the absence of a hospital birth, in Hawaii, the place of birth on the long form Certificate is whatever fact or fiction she chose for her new baby.
    [/quote:2bsfdt1n]





    You know what MinuteMan, you just brought something to mind.

    Have you looked into what the rules were concerning the documentation of home births in HI back then?

    The reason I ask is because most states only require........or did require if the laws have since changed.........that a home birth be recorded within a certain amount of time after it occured.

    Remember, there is no law saying that a woman who has chosen home birthing ever HAS to go to a hospital or even be seen by a doctor after delivering.

    Same goes for the infant.

    In fact, there's a big ta-do going on over this right now in various countries....including this one.......where they want to mandate that women who have chosen some type of home birthing....whether it be through midwifery or self birthing......be overseen by medical doctors and then must also submit themselves and their newborns for post natal care by doctors.

    What I'm getting at here is this: Supposing that he was born in Kenya and for whatever her reasons she wanted him listed as having been born in US, there was probably nothing which prevented her from stepping off that plane from Kenya with a days.........even weeks?.......old infant and going to have his birth recorded stating that he was born at home somewhere in HI.

    So far the assumption is that there is the name of a hospital and doctor on any original BC issued in HI......if there is, in fact, one at all....but, if it does exist no one has seen it so how does anyone know it even lists a hospital or doctor?
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  7. #197
    Senior Member BetsyRoss's Avatar
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    Besides, what evidence to we have that Stanley Ann's ambitions for her son were even political, much less presidential? Talking about what hypothetically COULD have happened, if x, y, and z were done 47 years ago says absolutely nothing about what DID happen back then. Occam's razor comes to mind.
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  8. #198
    Senior Member azwreath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BetsyRoss
    Besides, what evidence to we have that Stanley Ann's ambitions for her son were even political, much less presidential? Talking about what hypothetically COULD have happened, if x, y, and z were done 47 years ago says absolutely nothing about what DID happen back then. Occam's razor comes to mind.





    Quite honestly, BR.......political aspirations for the baby were never anything I even thought about as the reason.

    Back in 1961 why would this have been important?

    Societal and family pressures maybe?

    Would life in Kenya at that time, like it was in so many other countries, have been miserable for a native born mixed race child, or worse, a child which was 1/2 American? obama talks alot about his perception of her parents not being overly happy about her bi-racial bent in relationships, but how were such things received by the paternal side of the family, the Kenyan population in general and the government? Because he never really mentions anything about that, people automatically assume that it equates to tolerance and acceptance of the situation. But the fact is that he doesn't really KNOW how the bi-racial marriage and child were received in Kenya by anyone, does he?

    Could there already have been problems in the marriage and she was afraid of finding herself without rights to her child in Kenya that she would have here?

    Was there internal strife in Kenya which would have made a mother think about having to get herself and/or her child out of harm's way quickly if necessary?

    Was it easier for her to bring the baby back and forth on US passport to visit her parents than it would have been on a foreign one?


    In other words, there are many reasons why a mother would be compelled to register her child as a US birth........IF she did......and to say that it was done in advance of a baby's rise to power some 40 years later is, I think, stretching it just a tad.
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  9. #199
    Senior Member BetsyRoss's Avatar
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    Many people are treating this issue as if it were a Victorian murder mystery. A body is found, and people assemble in the drawing room to try and figure out how it happened. But that's backwards - how do we know anything wrong happened? It's that assumption on the part of many people that bothers me. Yes, his childhood was unorthodox. But so was mine, and I'm a citizen. It's like people are having trouble believing that the Obama presidency really happened, but it did. Remember, a lot of people who voted for him didn't necessarily want him, but were just tired of the W years.
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  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by BetsyRoss
    - how do we know anything wrong happened?
    You are right, Betsy, that we don't know if anything wrong happened. But here is the kicker. This man had a response team to handle anything that came up during the election. If McCain ran an add that said that the sun rose in the east, within 6 hours the Obama camp came out and had a competing add that contested the fact. Now, for a team that has their stuff so well put together that they can turn around responses to anything that arises in the campaign so well and so easily, why couldn't they respond to this? They came out and said that the lawsuits against them are "Garbage". They refuse to deal with them. All of this would have been averted by a simple news conference after Phillip Berg filed his first lawsuit.

    Obama's press secretary goes out and says something to this effect.

    Yesterday a lawyer filed a lawsuit claiming that Senator Obama is not a natural born citizen. We demand that this lawsuit be withdrawn in the next 24 hours or we will counter-sue for defamation of character. By the way, here is the legal, certified copy of his Certificate of Live Birth, showing he was born at XYZ hospital in Honolulu, and Dr. Who was the delivering doctor. Have a nice day.

    Did this happen? NO!! What happened instead? He avoided the issue, then produced a bad forgery of a Certification of Live Birth, that even the State of Hawaii says cannot be used for identification without some other corroborating evidence. He moved to have the cases dismissed because of technicalities that the average citizen needs a copy of Black's Law Dictionary to understand. Now there are over 15 lawsuits in 15 states that he won't deal with. How hard is it to produce a piece of paper. Its not like he has to fly halfway around the world to get it. Or does he? He went to Hawaii twice since this all got started. It would be nothing for him to go get the documentation and make this all go away. Yet he refuses to. Why?

    There are only 3 reasons.

    1. Obama was born somewhere else other than Hawaii and the Birth Certificate says so.

    2. Obama was born in Hawaii but there is something else contained on the Birth Certificate that is embarrassing.

    3. Obama was born in Hawaii. There is nothing embarrassing on the Birth Certificate. Obama wants to disregard the Constitution to weaken it. He has already stated that the Constitution has fatal flaws in it.

    Now I am not normally one to jump on the Conspiracy Theory bandwagon. However, if you logically follow HIS actions, they do not follow the mentality of someone who has nothing to hide.
    "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference. Marines don't have that problem."*
    Ronald Reagan


    Semper Fi!

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