Thread: Verbal sparring over citizenship leads to shooting

No we cannot back down

Alipac, I've registered at the website, but have to wait for confirmation email to post. Will do so as soon as I get comfirmation.

Hi... first time poster...thank you for giving those of us frustrated Legal American Citizens a place to interact with Americans who value our Country. I live in Northern Nevada...home of the west's largest Cinco de Mayo Celebration. My kids love the great outdoors, horses, rodeo...etc...We participate in junior rodeo and horse games events at several various arenas in the area. One in particular is the arena depicted in the article below. Last year, my kid's rodeo followed the Mexican Rodeo at this arena that had been held the day before. When the parents arrived with kid's and horses and other livestock in tow to set up for our rodeo, we arrived to find the rodeo grounds completely trashed with broken bottles all over the place, about 30-40 empty syringe needles on the ground and in the shoots where the animals line up for entry for their event. Empty food containers and trash from the day before were everywhere you looked. It took our families 2 hours just to secure the area for our events to take place that day and insure that our animals and families would be safe. The article I'm posting is this years turn of events at their "Wonderful Family Event". I can tell you in the 4 years we have been going to rodeos in the area...we have never seen this kind of violence. Yeah there have been beer brawls...but no one ever pulled out a gun and shot a horse and potentially killed several people! This really scares me that we are heading in a direction that turns our communities for the sake of "Preserving our Mexican Traditions" into some gun toting crazy Mexican old west. Any way the irreverence for anything American...hello that is where you "Migrated" to, is unheard of. Thanks for letting me vent!

D

Organizers of Mexican rodeo say shooting mars family event
JACLYN O (online@rgj.com)
'MALLEY
JOMALLEY@RGJ.COM
May 16, 2006

A day after gunfire erupted at a Mother's Day-themed Mexican rodeo in Sparks -- killing a horse and grazing one person -- organizers fear the incident could mar the traditional family event.

No arrests had been made as of Monday. It could not be confirmed whether the incident was gang-related, said Sparks police Commander Steve Asher.

Police said a man brought a gun from the parking lot after a fight broke out at the Gandolfo Sports Arena. Several people were injured, most of them in the fight. Authorities and event officials say it was lucky that no one in the crowd of about 2,000 was killed or severely injured by the random gunfire.

"We want to make it clear that the Mexican rodeo with its professional riders had nothing to do with (the shooting)," said event organizer Joe F. Salinas. "It was odd to look up and recognize gunshots and then looking at people, trying to make sure everyone was safe. Everyone was in fear of their lives.

"We don't want any (gang) stereotypes," he said. "This was a positive event until the shooting."

Just before 7 p.m. Sunday the event had started to wind down. The music had stopped. Professional charros, or Mexican cowboys, had led their horses out of the arena, where spectators began to gather. The nearly 2,000 people who packed the grandstands were walking back to their cars. Then the shooting started.

"People were panicked, crying and hiding behind buildings," Salinas said. "There was popping (of the gun). Moms were frightened and grabbed their children. There were a lot of children."

Salinas said police arrived quickly and many people were questioned. Cars were being checked until about 9:30 p.m.

Salinas and Jose Valencia, another official who saw the shooting, said the incident started when a group of young men challenged people laughing at a woman or girl who fell off a horse in the arena.

Police said the heckling led to a fight. Then a group of young men ripped off their T-shirts, exposing many tattoos, and ran to the parking lot, Salinas said. One man, 16 to 19 years old, came back with a gun and began shooting, apparently at someone, as he stood on a hillside rock, Valencia said.

"We're lucky no one got hurt," Valencia said. "I don't know why he had a gun. He didn't seem like he had been hurt in a fight. This kind of thing does ruin the event."

"It's one of those things you don't expect and you can't prevent," he said. "They'd have to be crazy to do something like this. It's just stupid."

The eight unarmed security guards at the event chased the group of young men who ran from the arena, he said. For future rodeos, Valencia said it's likely more security guards will be hired and possibly begin searching cars for weapons. Currently, guards had just been checking for alcohol in vehicles.

Sunday's jaripeo, Spanish for rodeo, was the first one this year, Salinas said. The Mexican rodeos have been held in the area since 2003, he said. Last year there were four. This year, three more have been scheduled.

"Everything had been perfect," said Sergio Morelos, president of the local Charros federation and shooting witness. "This sport is an opportunity to keep children out of gangs and to keep up with Mexican tradition. I feel so sorry that this was meant to be a very professional event for Mother's Day and now this. It's really sad."

Morelos, of Rancho Haven, and his wife, Mariam, said they were disappointed that "a beautiful family event" had to be ruined by violence.

"This is a tragedy," Mariam Morelos said. "This has really scared a lot of people. It's sad to say we should profile (gang members), but it's come to that extreme though. Next we'll have to search vehicles.

"This is not the image we want," she said. "This wasn't supposed to happen."

Welcome, celtigl40,

You've found a great site. I'm truly sorry you've had such experiences. Here's my story if you're interested...

http://www.alipac.us/ftopict-25749-.html

We're all frustrated, but have found help on this site.

Read the various threads and feel free to jump in and help!

http://www.citizen-times.com/apps/pbcs. ... 15054/1010

CITIZEN-TIMES.com
Is immigration debate fueling hostility against Hispanics?


By Clarke Morrison
CMORRISON@CITIZEN-TIMES.COM
May 16, 2006 12:15 am
ASHEVILLE — Police don’t know whether a confrontation between whites and Hispanics at a West Asheville restaurant over the weekend that culminated in a shot being fired was sparked by the national debate over immigration.

No arrests were made in the 3 a.m. Saturday incident at the Waffle House on Smoky Park Highway, and the investigation is continuing, said Capt. Sarah Benson of the Asheville Police Department.

But some believe the current immigration debate is fueling tensions between Hispanics and others.

The National Council of La Raza issued a statement Friday asking the U.S. Department of Justice to investigate the recent beating and sexual assault of a 16-year-old Hispanic boy near Houston as a possible hate crime, and last week the Southern Poverty Law Center reported that an anti-immigration activist had urged a neo-Nazi group to harass, rob and beat illegal immigrants.

And the Anti-Defamation League issued a report on what it said is a growing number of assaults on legal and illegal immigrants.

“This report reminds us that there is a direct connection between the national policy debate and the atmosphere surrounding the daily lives of immigrants,” said the league’s national director, Abraham Foxman. “The rhetoric we are seeing about Hispanics is downright scary.

“While these sentiments are often relegated to the private chat rooms, blogs and message boards maintained by hate groups, it only takes one individual with hate in his heart to act on these notions. For us, that’s a real concern as the national discussion on immigration continues to gain momentum.”

Edna Campos, organizer of the recent We Are One America immigration-rights rally in Asheville, said the immigration debate is raising tensions here.

“There is an increase in this area of people being polarized,” she said. “Fear mongers are saying, ‘These criminals are taking our jobs. They are terrorists.’ That’s all raising people’s fear. People want to stir things up. They want people to be polarized.”

In Saturday’s incident, a gunshot from a vehicle leaving the Waffle House shattered a window and caused a minor injury following an argument between whites and Hispanics inside, police said.

“The two groups were jawing back and forth with each other over citizenship issues and whatnot,” Lt. Wallace Welch said.

According to a police report, the shooting suspect was seated at a table with another Hispanic man and two white women. Whites at two other tables made comments “in reference to the suspect being Hispanic,” Benson said.

“The suspect stood up to leave, and the victim, who was seated at one of the tables, saw a gun in his waistband,” she said. “He followed the suspect outside the building, and that’s when the suspect shot toward the victim and into the building.”

The shot shattered a large window at the restaurant. The victim’s arm was bleeding when police arrived, but it’s not known if the injury was cause by a bullet fragment or flying glass. The victim declined medical treatment.

The case remains under investigation, Benson said.

Police Chief Bill Hogan said he’s not aware of any increase in criminal activity related to race or ethnic background. Hate crimes in Asheville are very rare, he said.

“What I’ve seen to this point is conflicts are not really based on race as much as what the incident is,” Hogan said. “As we investigate cases, we keep an eye out to determine if the motive for a criminal act is ethnic or race-based.”

Contact Clarke Morrison at 828-232-5849

President Bush's speech on illegal immigration was white wash and if the House of Representatives remains firm on their Bill, we will not have an immigration bill at all this year. The situation will get ugly as the demographics of many areas of the country have changed to where Hispanics dominate. The Hispanics no matter where they come from are very nationalistic about their ethnicity, that is Spanish people tend to stick together no matter what. Right now it is whites against spanish and the situation will have a tendency to polarize into something very ugly andspread across this country. It is high time that the US government do its job and start to deport every illegal alien that is caught but we have wimpy Senators and Congressman who will not obey the oath they had taken. The silent majority should take note of every Senator and Congressman in their district and state and vote every incumbent out of office that does not support building a wall and deportation.

Like I’ve been saying in my circle of friends and family “There is unfortunately no peaceful solution to this”, because if the illegals don’t get exactly what they want they are going to riot and take it by force “these are their words”, and I think we have to be honest with ourselves and say that the American citizens, with the exception of but a few, are about finished with any pseudo diplomatic attempts at solving this issue, we have voted ourselves, polled ourselves, faxed, telephoned, emailed and resorted to mailing bricks till we’re blue in the face. And to what effect but to be utterly and completely ignored by those who are supposed to be representing us, “We the People”.

Our founding fathers left Europe for this very reason, they knew that regardless of how loudly they yelled they were going to be ignored by those that ruled over them. And that’s why our government was designed totally different than any other government that existed. It was to be based on a totally new concept “We the People”, and they were so adamant about this that the first thing they did, practically before the ink was dry on our Constitution, was to fashion amendments to it so that specific areas where described in detail so as to protect them and more importantly to protect “We the People”.

These later became known as our Bill of Rights, and the two that are most important to the situation at hand are also the two at the top of the list, both the 1st and 2nd amendments. The first, not to get it confused with the interpretation of many liberals, was framed to give “We the People” the right to assemble and speak our minds to those who “represent us”, in Europe they had been ruled by a monarchy and the people had virtually no say in what their rulers did, they were peasants, mere workers that were more than not treated like a slave cast by the Nobles. Now in the new land they wanted to make sure that didn’t happen again, they wanted the nation they were creating to be controlled by them “We the People”.

And the 2nd amendment was to guaranty that “We the People” had the means to forcibly retake our government, prosecute those that were committing crimes (including treason) against “We the People”, so that we could hold new free elections and solve the mess and restore order and justice.

It bugs me that everyone, when referring to the structure of our government, only recognize three branches of government, when actually there are four. We all understand ( at least I sure hope we all understand) why our government was divided into multiple entities, is was so that each facet of our government could be a check and balance against the others so that no one facet could gain total power and thus take the power and control away from “We the People”.

And it’s “We the People” that make up the forth, and largest mind you, facet of our government. I know you would think that they are the rulers and we are the peons, but that was never the case and as long as sufficient numbers of “We the People” exist that refuse to kowtow to our representatives and allow ourselves to be reduced to a state of indentured servitude then we shall remain a free nation ruled by “We the People”.

I can not state this fact any better than our founding fathers did in our Declaration of Independence when they said:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

It’s “We the People” that are the rulers and not them, if we want to keep it that way we better start acting more like rulers and less like peasants, whining, bitching and moaning to those who only ignore us and our sentiments.

I know not how others will be, but when I die there will be absolutely no question of where my loyalties lie, first and foremost with God and my Savior the Christ, and the second is with “We the People”.

MMILLAGE............Now THAT was well said!!

Originally Posted by anniealone

Unfortunately, this is only the beginning I fear.

I wouldn't worry about it, annie. The overwhelming majority of Americans are just about at the breaking point of their RAGE towards these illegal invaders. And it'll probably only take one or two more of these violent kind of situations for the backlash to explode back in their chump faces.

My biggest fear is -- just like the Rodney King riots -- its only going to take one highly-charged violent incident before America explodes in rage (which can easily get out of control) and we start herding these people like cattle back to their own wretched countries.

But when and if this happens, it will be the fault of idiots like George Bush and Bill Clinton and Ted Kennedy who let this situation fester for 30 years until it finally exploded like a puss-filled boil.

Despite the shooting in NC and Antioch, I do not think our biggest problem is the illegals.
However, our largest problem in my option is Washington, and then they try to justify it.