Thread: wow...the campus is in an uproar over our campaign!!!

Mr. Rynard:

Thank you for contacting me about your efforts to label Mr. Beard and his CTB group as a bunch of "racists". It is shameful and offensive to those of us that have been involved in civil rights efforts before to see you so flagrantly play the race card on this issue.

Please pay close attention to my responses to your allegations. I find it offensive that you and your group and certain other groups are so fervently trying to scream and shout down another group that is exercising their rights of free speech on such an important issue. You quickly move to try and derail any logical discussion of the issue by injecting charges of racism. This is a sad and immature tactic that degrades the conversation and becomes the Cry of Wolf. There is real racism in the world Mr. Rynard. It is to bad you would discredit yourself by launching false attacks.

See below.


> Mr. Gheen-
> My name is Patrick Rynard, a student at Drake University, the president of
> the
> Drake Democrats and the political columnist who harshly criticized the new
> organization Citizens for Tight Borders on our campus.
>
> I just wanted to contact you to try to give you some perspective on Frank
> Beard's efforts with the CTB group and why Drake University has been
> reacting
> so negatively to it. I've been reading through his posts on your
> website's
> forums and can see why it appears we are all being very intolerant of his
> views. However, this is largely because he has been VERY selective in
> what
> stories from Drake he has told.
>
> As some of his later posts have shown, he's been surprised that his former
> friends in the College Republicans group have been so hostile toward him,
> yet
> he gives little reasoning for it. As a skilled political activist and
> analyst,
> I'm sure you would start to find it odd that his beliefs are getting
> absolutely
> no support - they cannot even grow their membership past their two
> founders (a
> group here needs 4 for formal recognition).

That remains to be seen. Mr. Beard has not solicited others to join his group yet. I'm certain you are doing all you can to prevent other students from joining his group by scaring them by indicating you are willing to falsely label them racists at the first opportunity.


>
> Let me try to provide you with a list of why Drake students have found the
> CTB
> organization very offensive, and for some, very racist:
>
> - His partner in the group is well-known on campus for being extremely
> far-right
> conservative, with a history of racial insenstivity (and I'm not talking
> little
> PC stuff, I'm talking clear racist remarks)

Really? Where is your documentation of these "racist" remarks. I'm sure that since you have written such an extensive e-mail to me you would clearly list the documentation of this racism. You should have this at the ready since making such claims without documentation or evidence is considered libel and slander which you can be charged with.

>
> - Frank himself on his Facebook profile has numerous comments that are
> incredibly racist toward Muslims and Mexicans, including this: "This furor
> over
> the muhammad cartoons is ridiculous. I'd love to see every major newspaper
> publish them. First off, they aren't as offensive as people make them out
> to
> be. Especially the one with the bomb as the turban. Who usually are the
> suicide
> bombers? Yeah...I thought so. That image exemplifies what Islam represents
> for
> most people."

Is this your example of racism? Since Frank feels the cartoons should be in the paper he is a racist? Come now, what a red herring. You are quite selective about what you decide will serve as evidence of racism sir.

>
> - The phrase that offended students most on their first posters was not
> "invading" but when it talked about the "threats to our traditional
> cultural
> atmosphere" that immigrants pose. To many students, talking about
> 'traditional
> culture' sounds like you're against racial diversity.

If traditional culture equals racism then Black Americans and Latino Americans all must be racists in your book. Not to mention any American that celebrates things as American including the fourth of July. One again you offer a false comparison that throws your charges of racism at the wild and deliberate interpretations by those that support illegal immigration.

Just because some groups support illegal immigration, it does not give them the right to arbitrarily decide that non-racist material must become racist by definition.

>
> - They greatly offended people even more when they passed out information
> at
> Drake's Multiculturalism Forum. They had never actually done anything on
> campus other than putting up posters before this, so it seemed like they
> were
> connecting their issue with multiculturalism or race. Since they picked
> this
> event specifically, it raised many more questions in people's minds on
> their
> true intent.

Sounds like some people at the Forum see people as racist no matter what. Did it ever cross your mind they wanted to reach a broad audience with their message? Once again, you are making a false assumption of racial motivations and in truth you don't know that and have no evidence of that. That makes you a liar.


>
> - Some of the rather racist posts on your forums about several Drake
> students
> upset even more people - while they were not Frank's words, the
> association
> with these types of people pile on the questions.
>

Sir, we do not allow racists posts or racism on our boards. Once again you are either confused or trying to libel our organizations and board users.

> When all of this is put together, it created a very negative view of the
> CTB
> group from students on campus.

Actually, all you have put together is a bunch of smoke and mirrors to try and deceive people. You may be overestimating yourself as having created this view campus wide.


Frank has only been talking about the good
> things they have done and the least rational responses they have gotten.
>
> He mentioned that when I came up and talked to them while they were
> outside the
> multiculturalism forum, that I just rambled on about stuff and obviously
> knew
> nothing about immigration. However, that was not what I was talking about
> to
> him. I, and many other students at Drake, believe that illegal
> immigration is
> a problem and needs to be addressed. What I was arguing with them about,
> however, is that the way they went about it was very tactless and just
> downright stupid. Anything about immigration has the possibility of being
> connected to race, and because of their leaders, wording, and actions they
> immediately fell right into that trap and discredited themselves.
>

Mr. Rynard, it is clear from your statements here the nobody could address illegal immigration on your campus without you making wild charges of racism. You complain about Frank's methods of bringing the issue up, well when have you ever approached the topic? Please provide for me one shred of documentation that shows you have made statements about being concerned about illegal immigration before these fliers went up please.

> This is some of what I wrote in my editorial against CTB, which Frank
> declined
> to post:
>
> "Campus conservatives are at it again. Conservative students Danielle
> Sturgis
> and Frank Beard recently created Citizens for Tight Borders, a group
> concerned
> about illegal immigration. But rather than address this important topic in
> a
> civil manner, they chose to use rhetoric that borders on racism to get
> attention. Making arguments that immigrants are “threats to our
> traditional
> cultural atmosphere” deeply offended many students, but it shouldn’t be a
> surprise from people who consistently choose radicalism over reality,
> discrimination over discourse, and fear over facts.

If you wrote this letter to the editor about me I would sue you and the paper so fast your socks would fall off! When you say "they chose to use rhetoric that borders on racism" you are calling them racists. You are saying borders on racism so you can call them that when you have no evidence of such. That's like me saying you are using rhetoric that borders on pedophilia.


>
> Is this particular group racist? A lot of students on campus seem to think
> so.....
>
Yes, once again. You offer as evidence that some people think so. This is disgusting and is a clear example of dirty politics.


> Still, there is nothing wrong with bringing up issues like immigration.
> Problems
> arise, however, when you approach them in such a tactless way, although
> it’s
> one of the only avenues these extremists can use to get noticed."
>

Who are you calling extremists? Mr. Beard is an extremist because he put up fliers?

>
> Anyway, all I am trying to say to you in this rather long e-mail is that
> Drake
> students are less offended about the issues they raise, and more about the
> tactless way in which they did it. Because of their lack of political
> foresight, their actions have largely backfired on themselves.
>
> I would not be so arrogant as to tell you what to do when working with
> Frank
> from now on, but I would simply suggest that you be cautious. The people
> that
> are representing your organization's worthy topic and issues may have
> raised
> awareness, but only in a very negative way. They lack the skills
> necessary to
> present it in a rational, respectable way that could win people over to
> your
> ideas and policies.
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
> --
> Patrick Rynard
> President, Drake Democrats
> 573-694-3024
> ptr003@drake.edu
> www.drakedems.com
>


Yes, Mr. Rynard, I agree. I think Frank and his people need some help since they are faced with people such as yourself that are eager to falsely label them and defame them in front of the public at your University. I believe I will adjust my schedule some as to assist them. Unfortunately, one of the first tasks at hand will be to point out to the entire student body that you are a very skillful liar Mr. Rynard and you have abused any sense of morality, honesty, and truthfulness in your effort to malign their character instead of discussing the issue.

You will see evidence of my response to you in the public eye very shortly sir.

William Gheen
President, Americans for Legal Immigration PAC
Www.alipac.us

Mr. Gheen sure has a way with words... nice..

It seems the only thing the opponents can come up with is to attack the method at which Frank approached the issue. Meaning, putting up posters offends them. I remember when I was in college, I and others would put up posters all the time with no issue.. Though, be careful around on-campus post offices, that a big no no.

Bravo, William. The little dweeb is probably peeing in his shoes!

William you really pegged him! This is a perfect example of political correctness running amoke on our college campuses! What did Mr. Rino, oops, Rynard say he was? A political columnist? I think he needs to change majors.

Dear Patrick Rynard:

I've just read your diatribe of nefarious and slanderous postulations that you wrote to William Gheen concerning the efforts of Frank Beard and his campus organization known as Citizen's for Tighter Borders. You accuse Mr. Beard of racist remarks, and being a racist...a rather serious allegation, and a typical RED HERRING offered up by those who wish to support illegal aliens who are stealing our way of life here in America...I'm assuming then by your charges that you support an endless stream of criminals marching across our borders to tax our social services system, steal our jobs, and in many cases RUIN once fine outstanding middle class communities?

First, lets look at some realities concerning these illegal aliens.

1. They (illegal aliens), and those that support them (such as the Catholic Church) want to make the claim they only take jobs we as Americans do not want. Perhaps when they were only working as migrant farm workers, that might have been true to a limited extent, but in today's United States of America, nothing could be further from the truth. In December a raid at a construction site in Penn. for a new Walmart distribution center netted several dozen illegal aliens on the job site, while hard working unionized middle class Americans sat home OUT OF WORK. When did middle class Americans chose to give up good paying jobs in the construction trade?

2. Illegal aliens claim they pay taxes, and to a degree that IS TRUE...however, if you look at the net bottom line contributions verse expenditures, illegal aliens on a yearly basis use almost 15 BILLION DOLLARS more in services than they contribute into the system. This does not count hidden costs, such as the billions of dollars we are forced to spend yearly just in printing up documents in Spanish, providing translators in criminal prosecutions, and other assorted costs associated with millions of people who steadfastly refuse to learn the English language and properly assimilate into American society.

3. A basic law of economics states that for every dollar you put into the economy, you add five more, and vice versa, for every dollar taken out, you eliminate five dollars from the economy. The United States yearly loses over 100 Billion dollars in remittances, the money that illegal's send back to their HOME COUNTRIES. In short, that is over a half of one trillion dollars STOLEN FROM OUR ECONOMY on a yearly basis from people that are here illegally, working here illegally. The taxes collected on that amount of money would pay for the war in Iraq over a period of about 3-5 years. If you support illegal aliens, then you ARE NOT SUPPORTING OUR TROOPS, because you embrace illegal aliens stealing money that could be used to fund their efforts.

4. Did you by any chance know, that the FASTEST growing segment of our American society is children BORN TO THOSE HERE ILLEGALLY? Have you bothered to do any research regarding the hidden costs of these quasi citizens who in my mind are wrongly granted INSTANT CITIZENSHIP by the mere convenience of having a criminal parent rush across our border to give birth. The law needs to be changed, this practice has to stop.

5. Conservative estimates state that illegal aliens working within the borders of the United States of America depress middle class wages by well over 200 BILLION dollars on an annual basis...in short, those who can least afford lower wages are being significantly penalized by President Bush's wrong sighted vision of creating a Guest Worker Program that is nothing but a ruse to eventual American citizenship. How many of the students on your campus come from low income families, how many of your students are getting PELL and TAP grants for school? Every one of those students wages are being unfairly depressed by these ILLEGAL WORKERS.

6. Are you aware that thousands of illegal aliens are attending our American colleges at in state tuition fees, while legalized American citizens are being forced to pay out of state tuition? Is that really fair and equitable? As president of your own on campus organization, what would you say to one of these American students being so unfairly treated?

Now, I am curious, with this very real reality, in what fashion would you prefer Frank and his group bring up the issue? Would he be WRONG in pointing out the huge number of crimes that have been attributed to illegal aliens? Should he and his group sit idly by while criminals cross our Southern border to steal our jobs and way of life? Oh, I forgot, you were upset about that kind of and allegation...let me give you a clue here based on my own real life experiences with some of these illegals.

I live in Westchester county in the state of New York. My wife and I have the misfortune of having three houses in our neighborhood that have been bought up by absentee landlords who rent them out to HORDES of illegal's. Not trying to be derogatory here, but you have NO IDEA what we have been put through.

1. These people to save money (to send home as remittances) seem quite content to live 20, 30 even 40 to a house. These homes were not built to accommodate that many human beings, and it creates problems. One such problem is parking...most of these illegal's have managed to purchase cars, which means a house that should have two, or maybe three vehicles now has 12-15 vehicles. Sounds like a small matter, but as someone paying over $5,000 in property taxes, I should be able to park in front of my own home, instead of having to park two of three blocks away from my house and then walk home through a foot of snow on a cold winter night.

2. Often times, these flop houses are filled with young single men, and since they seem to have nothing more to do, they drink a lot, especially on the weekends. We wake up and find ourselves picking up their discarded liqueur bottles that were rudely tossed into our formal garden beds, we have peeked out our living room window to see these men publicly urinating in plain view of any one who happens to be watching. They have even been SO BOLD as to park themselves in our back yard, using our lawn furniture as if it were theirs because they thought us asleep. We now have to turn our outside faucets off because we found out they were using our water and our hose to wash their cars when we were at work. Now, from my way of thinking, such antics DO STEAL AWAY OUR WAY OF LIFE. Last spring because of the large pile of garbage behind their house we had to deal with RATS...one of them found its way into our back yard and ended up drowning in our pool...it cost us $200 to have the pool re-sanitized.

3. Two winters ago I looked out my side window and these illegal aliens were shoveling their driveway...problem was, they were throwing it up onto the walkway along the side of my house! When I shoveled it back from whence it came, they called the police and I was charged with trespass...sure, I eventually won my case, but it cost me six days away from work, and a couple of thousand dollars.

4. Just this past Christmas Eve they were having another one of their drunken parties celebrating the birth of Christ. My wife and I made three noise complaints, the first not filed with the police until almost one in the morning on Christmas Day. Other neighbors made similar complaints, but nothing was done...police would show up, the music would be turned down, and then as soon as they left, up went the volume. Finally, around 3:30 in the morning we managed to fall off to sleep only to be woken at around 4:30 in the morning by someone repeatedly ringing our doorbell. I put on my robe and went downstairs...when I peeked out, there were three drunk Mexicans on my front porch so I called the police. Turns out they were SO DRUNK that they had the wrong house...again nothing was done because the police know even if they issued a citation that said ticketed person would not show up for court. So, my wife and I had OUR CHRISTMAS RUINED by the antics of people who are in our country illegally.

Yet, much as you have done with Frank, when I start beating the drums and calling for our borders to be secured and those here illegally to be deported, these same illegal aliens want to play the race card and call me a bigot. I have a history of grievances that give me just cause to not like this criminal element living next to me, have a history of grievances that justify not wanting criminals granted Amnesty. I'm a landscaper, but I cannot compete with the pricing structure illegal aliens bring to my line of work unless I A) stop paying taxes, or B) hire them (illegal's) so that I can bid competitively in the market place. Is this the kind of America you and your young Democratic cohorts endorse. Mr. Beard standing up for Americans and the American way of life is just cause for his former Republican friends to distance themselves from him? Is this the message you as a responsible young American are sending out to the world?

I'm very serious here...just how would you have Mr, Beard bring this delicate subject up on your campus? You and others are upset that Mr. Beard had the unmitigated GALL to hand out leaflets during a multiculturalism forum, state that some (yourself?) found it racist and deliberately inflammatory. Sense when is being again illegal aliens criminally breaking our laws a racist act? I am pro-choice here, support gay marriage and other alternative life styles, and have no problems with people of ANY RACE. If someone is in our country legally, regardless of their race, religion or sexual orientation, I am there to lend a helping hand, and believe they are deserving of any help we as a nation can give them in finding our great nation a welcoming new home. I do not though have any tolerance for those who thwart our laws, do not have open arms for those who have come here illegally. Contrary to what you may believe, we do have limits to the number of world citizens this nation can realistically absorb, and President Fox and millions of his citizens have far surpassed our abilities, and it is PAST TIME to say ENOUGH ALREADY. Yet, when one of your students takes a stand, speaks his mind, exercises his FREEDOM OF SPEECH, you chose to have him censured...tell me, who is the prejudiced one in this unfortunate set of events, who is the one with the closed mind?

If Frank and his organization need my help, I'm here for them, and it is my sincere hope that the president of your college has more class and intellect than you so far have exhibited throughout the course of the events surrounding the creation of "Citizens for Secure Borders on your campus.

Sincerely,

Sherwood Martinelli

Pintobean, I am speechless! Go get em! I had the same problem. They would blast the music, I would call the police. As soon as the police drove into the neighborhood they would turn the music down and as soon as the police left, they turned it back up. I WATCHED THEM DO IT! The last time after calling the police twice, I got dressed (1:00 am) and went over and told them to turn it down. They did not turn it back up. I guess the fact that my husband and I like to go target practicing at the local FOB range might have a bit of a deterent affect so to speak.

And Blueman, lets not forget the fact that the identity theft crisis is being fueled by illegal aliens since they are the ones needing these fraudulent ID's.

Hi Ohfly:

Nice to know some here appreciate my contributions...seems a few are less than pleased at my being present on this board.

Pinto Bean

Originally Posted by PintoBean

Hi Ohfly:

Nice to know some here appreciate my contributions...seems a few are less than pleased at my being present on this board.

Pinto Bean

My suggestion is to buy a video camera or closed circuit security camera, place it out side your home and start recording when this activity is going on.

Damn good letter the both of you....

Pinto Man, WTG Id like to see a come back from that...

We Legal U.S. Citizens feel your pain... my development was once quiet...
Now it looks like a used car lot in P.A.

I would not even think of living in a location where I cannot speak the language...

The store at the top of my street beings (what looks to be illegal) to my development... my next door neighbor used to have chickens in his shed like a makeshift coupe... that was not going to fly with me,, or my Dog..
So that is a done deal now... And we did PEACEFULY...

xxx