Thread: GOP forms strategy to OK guest workers

Originally Posted by lawman

What kind of news story is this? This is NORMAL and this is how bills are always passed. Differences in the bills are worked out in committee. Paranoia makes people think there is some vast conspiracy out there to give "amnesty" to illegals.

I have seen NOTHING on this website or from the anti-immigration crowd that is a satisfactory option to the immigration problem. Do you guys want to ship out all the illegals to some sort of modern-day Liberia (which was the removal of former slaves back to Africa).

Why do you people feel so threatened by a dishwasher from Mexico, or a hotel room cleaner who may not have their papers?

Security is a STUPID argument. Virtually EVERY ONE of the hijackers on 9-11 entered legally to the country.

If you really want to stop the flow of people from Mexico so you can really find the dangerous ones, then support a guest worker program.

You can try to move a mountain by supporting some irrational, impractical immigration solution or you can legally let the workers in.

Those of you who can't seem to consider alternatives must have some other form of motivation beyond logic and reason. Emotional reasons such as racism, prejudice, and the desire to have someone to hate lower on the social strata than yourselves.

If you're threatened by immigrant labor, then get an education and get a better job.

If you're threatened by possible security breaches, then have a guest worker program to better track the immigrants who will come no matter what law you pass.

If you're worried about all of the resources illegals are taking from the economy, then give them back the social security and FICA taxes they pay in but NEVER TAKE OUT! Take away their MASSIVE input into our economy which far outweighs the minority of immigrants who abuse the system.

LAWMAN. You are BANNED and I BAN you with fervor!

You should have read and respected our rules. Normally, I'd let you stay a bit so we could make an example of you but as you can see we are very busy fighting this disquised amnesty.

Like a standard Open Borders troll you attack on motives instead of content. You call us paranoid which is both a false accusation and name calling.

Furthermore, you are clearly RACE BAITING.

"Those of you who can't seem to consider alternatives must have some other form of motivation beyond logic and reason. Emotional reasons such as racism, prejudice, and the desire to have someone to hate lower on the social strata than yourselves."

Translation: You disagree with me therefore you are racists.

RACE BAITING is as bad as RACISM and we will not tolerate it on our boards.

You have not even looked at our platform.

We believe that if we enforce our existing immigration laws and secure our borders, as America has done in the past then we can stem the flow of illegal aliens into America and reverse the polarity on this migration trend.

The laws already exist. The American public supports this and you are one of the liberals that wants to stop the majority by calling those that do not agree threatening names.

We are busy today. No time to play with RACE BAITING TROLLS.

ZAP.

LAWMAN IS BANNED.

W

OK, I am BANNED. Is this because I am articulating challenges to your point of view? (Do you want to deport me, too?) Don't try to put a false misrepresentation on what I said. If you want to talk about facts, let us do so.

Your argument needs some clarification. When you talk about loss of national identity, those arguments sound a lot like the anti-immigration groups of the past who were worried about Irish Catholic and Southern European immigration of the early last century. I don't think our country is diluted.

In addition, where is your citation for the Harvard study? You know, there are countless other studies that cotradict the findings of studies you are quoting.

I have a few questions for you.

Do you really think our economy is doing that badly? We have the strongest economy in the history of the world, by many measures. Unemployment is low. The standard of living in the United States is the highest in the history of mankind.

Do you really think our immigration laws are NOT being enforced? Well, I'm willing to bet NOBODY on this website has ever set foot in an immigration courtroom or litigated deportation cases up to the U.S. Supreme Court. I have. Rest assured, my fine alipac colleagues, the immigration laws and their enforcement are in tact. If someone is here illegally, and they come to the governments attention, the laws will be enforced.

As an immigration insider, I do know a few areas where a few minor changes would have a DRASTIC effect on the ability of illegal immigrants to sustain themselves.

No new laws are needed. Has anyone on this website read IIRAIRA (1996 legislation) or AEDPA (mid-90's legislation)? You can't get much stricter than that. Passing those laws have not alleviated the immigration problem at all.

As for the sanctity of law argument, I think the prophet/philosopher/Lord (however you look at him) Jesus Christ said it best, Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. How many of you ever downloaded music without paying for it? You are stealing. You are thieves. You should be arrested, and our laws should be enforced. You are negatively affecting the well-being of the entertainment industry. OK, for those of you who don't steal music - have you ever speeded? You are breaking the law. We should have more officers, cameras on the streets, whatever, and we should put you through the court system. You are endangering people's lives. How many of your own ancestors violated immigration laws to come to the United States? Maybe that should be addressed as well. My point is - MANY PEOPLE, perhaps most, violate some law. Why focus on immigration violations? While the fact that others break the law do not excuse the breaking of the law by aliens, it is helpful to look at where we are focusing our attention.

When my ancestors came to the U.S. (I have my family history back to the 1600's here in the U.S.) it was a much different place. While the immigrants since then have definitely diluted the pure, single-nation immigrant population, I think we've done rather well since then.

Well, unfortunately, I have immigrant aliens to defend and I can't address and answer to all your other arguments at this time.

Let me tell you, though. There are EASY changes that could be made to make immigration less attractive to illegals. But your congressman must really not want it because they drag their feet. One example is, check EVERYBODY's Social Security number to make sure they match with the name before starting employment. There is a small pilot program right now, but if the government did this, thousands, perhaps millions, of illegal workers would have to leave their jobs. This is really a VERY easy thing to do. But your congressman and senators probably recognize the benefit to the economy of these workers, and they fail to do it. I just scratch my head.

Good bye, lawman, good ridance

I'm confused. Why are you saying good riddance? Isn't that an insult? Oh, you get to break the rules, right? I notice you did not make ONE response to my analytical arguments. I was not aware of your rules nor that I broke them. I imagine if I espoused your views you would be most kind to allow me to stay.

I will just be happy knowing NOTHING YOU CAN DO WILL CHANGE THE FACT THAT ILLEGALS WILL COME INTO THE COUNTRY. You've tripled the border patrol to no avail. You've made the laws stricter to no avail. Until there is a Nazi-type enforcement where everyone must carry a national id that is biometrically marked, you will not succeed in an illegal immigrant free country.

If I am banned, then let it be known that you ban the other side of the argument. That dilutes free speech and the constitution. Farewell.

I don't know why you were still posting but you're banned now lawman. We ban anyone that violates the forum rules, even supporters of this forum.

Why would someone say "good riddance" to lawman? Because with his posts it's clear that he is on the board to continue the "fog" technique of ending our nation.

Our economy is not the best in the world. Neither the nation nor its people can pay its debts. We are a DEBTOR NATION. Look around, talk to your neighbors, get personal with yourselves, your family, your close friends. Ask them:

1) Did anyone in your family or close friends lose a job in the past 5 years and are they still looking?

2) Does everyone in your family and close friendships have adequate health insurance?

3) Did they lose health insurance either through employers or individually because they can not afford it?

4) Does everyone make enough money to pay their bills without borrowing on credits cards or home equity lines?

5) Does anyone have any savings?

6) Is everyone that is working feel comfortable that when they retire the company pension will be available?

7) Has anyone had a promotion recently?

8) Has anyone had a raise recently?

9) For those who lost jobs and found another, was the new job at the same or higher rate of pay or lower?

10) For families, do your teen-agers who need jobs to learn responsibility and pay for their college or cars or part of their expense, like I did and millions of other Americans, have job opportunities to earn this money for themselves and help their families?

11) Does your town have more headlines about new businesses and factories opening up or are they more about business and plant closings?

12) Are the empty factory and manufacturing facilities in your town or county filling up with new manufacturing operations or are they still vacant, empty?

13) What has happened to all those workers who were laid off in the past 5 years?

14) Has the poverty rate in your community declined or increased?

15) Has your population grown or declined?

16) Who is moving in? New managers and professionals to run new durable goods manufacturing operations or foreign nationals from other nations taking your jobs and stealing benefits?

17) Have your rents, mortgages, utilities, taxes, fuel, insurance costs increased or decreased?

18) For those who had a raise, did the raise cover the increased costs mentioned in item 17)?

Answer these questions for your family, your friends, your town, your county, your state and let us know if there is any family, group of friends, town, county or state that is benefitting from this "economy".

Because that would be a really special place, I'd like to visit and analyze.

Lawman was apparenty a fraud trying to deceive the American Public.

And for that, I am delighted that he has been banned from this website.

Personally, I would have enjoyed playing with him for awhile, but there are more important issues at stake which include as the Number One Objective:

GETTING THE TRUTH TO THE AMERICAN PUBLIC AS SOON AS POSSIBLE

And obviously, an OBL troll intereferes with that critical mission.

Troll Be Gone and Good Riddance!!

UM---I THOUGHT lawman was BANNED??

Originally Posted by Bootsie

UM---I THOUGHT lawman was BANNED??

He should be now.

Hey Lawman. You are banned for coming on our boards and breaking our rules about Race Baiting and name calling. The rules are at the top of these discussion groups for all to read.

WE TOLERATE OPPOSING OPINIONS AND WELCOME THEM BUT WE WILL NOT HAVE NAME CALLING "paranoid" and RACE BAITING "You all must be racists" as these add nothing to the debate.

The reason LAWMAN could still post after I announced his Ban is that I wrote the message and then our website crashed for a bit this morning. I could not complete the ban and had to go to work.

Thanks Brian for completing the job. I'm glad LAWMAN was forthcoming by telling the board he is an immigration attorney and makes lots of money off of illegal immigrants.

To anyone that opposes us that reads this, you are welcome on our boards if you abide by our rules.

It's bad enough in the newspapers where those that defend your views which are supported by about 10% of America's LEGAL population have to resort to those tactics, but we wont allow them here.

W

Hey lawamn, don't leave mad, just leave, Oh, by the way, good ridance.