Thread: Can a past of Islam change the path to president for Obama?

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Radical Christians and radical Muslims.

The actions by Christians are not much different than the acts done by Muslims. Both interpret the Bible and Koran to fit their needs and actions.
At time, the Bible has sanctioned indiscriminate killings, although the command is “thou shall not kill”
God commanded the Israelites to go into the promise land and kill everything living:
Deut 20;16;17..you must not preserve a breathing thing alive..you should without fail devote them to destruction..just as you God has commanded...
Deut 7;16...you must consume all the people..must not feel sorry for them..
Were these Israelite terrorist?
Radical Christians have use these examples as an excuse to kill anyone not like them in race and religion.The Amonites, Hittite, Canaanite, Prizzites, Hivites were no threat except their religious belief. They did not attack the Israelites first. Still God commanded them to be exterminated.
Later when Christ came on the scene things changed, but Christian attitude did not and some have not changed even now.
Very few Christians follow his teachings and interpret the Bible to fit their actions and obey the scriptures as they wish.
1 Pet 2;21...Christ..a model for you to follow...
John 13;15...I set the pattern..
1 John 2;6...he that remains in union with him is under obligation..to go on walking as that one did.
Not many Christians follow Christ as early Christians did who practiced religion as a way of life. Now we do not feel it is a way of life any longer. Government is our way of life.
They obeyed the commandment “thou shall not kill” by not being a part of the Roman army and there are Christians that do not go to war under no circumstances. They believe;
Rom 12;17-19,21...vengeance in mine saith the lord..do not avenge yourself.1 Chro 20;17..you will not need to fight ...stand still and see the salvation of God in you behalf.... Do not be afraid...
Rom 12;17,18..return evil for evil to no one..
Pro 20;22..hope in God and he will save you..
1 Pet 15; Let none of you suffer as a murderer...
Matt 5;44..love you enemy...pray for those that persecute you..

How are we as Christians so different than Muslims who twist and interpret the Koran to fit their actions and needs.There are Christians and Muslims who do not twist the Bible and the Koran to fit their actions.
I’ve read nothing in the Bible that teaches that it is O.K. to war and kill for any reason. It shows that Christians do not believe or have faith in their God.

The most dangerous people on earth are the Evangicals who believe in wars, Jews are God’s chosen people and anything the do is O.K because it must be sanctioned by God. The are against abortions and kill abortion doctors and have no problem sending their children to die and kill other people children. Believe that since he profess to be a Christian that he was placed in office.
I condemn both, radical Christians and radical Muslims. They are alike more than they differ.
Matt 10;28..do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul.
Jude 5...god...saved a people out of Egypt, then destroyed those not showing faith. We are not showing faith in God and he will “bring to ruin, those ruining the earth.”
John 16;2...the hour is coming when everyone that kills you will imagine he has tendered a sacred service to God. They will do these things because they have not come to know either the Father or me...

There is no difference in the use of the Bible and Koran to support violence.
There is more violence approved in the Bible than in the Koran.
The entire population was destroyed during the flood. Jerusalem was destroyed twice. Sodom and Gomorrah destroyed, etc. holy wars was the norm in the old testament. Incest, polygamy, cannibalism, murder and all sorts of atrocities were sanctioned. Pat Robertson and other radical Christian pray for their God to be with Israel and Bush in killing. We force democracy on others countries and killing those who disagree. That is the way radical Christians interpret the Bible and their God and radical Muslims does the same.
Both are wrong and we need to pray they both go away before they destroy us all.Who is the terrorist, the murderer? Bush is as much a terrorist as Bin Laden. We used to call those who disagreed and fought against corruptions “revolutionist” and now we call them “terrorist.” We call our selves "liberators" and those we kill as "colateral damage."

and I am a Christian and I do not believe killing is a necessity in any situation.

Dyehard, you're just attempting to JUSTIFY by moral equivalency the malignancy of Islam. Are modern Christians beheading men for cutting their beards? Are they denying women the ability to read a book, venture from the home in anything less than a head-to-toes black body condom or stoning them for going to school? Are Christians blowing up buildings, killing innocent women and children in targeted assaults or proclaiming the imminent death of entire peoples or religions?

The answer to each question is a resounding "NO!"

We understand that you are almost certainly a Muslim and that you feel compelled to apologise for the muderous tendencies of your brothers in the faith. But just as a gang member's defense of a fellow gang member for killing a cop or "accidentally" shooting an innocent kid in the head in a drive by is unacceptable, so is defense of the murderous and primitive nutballs who represent the Islamic leadership in many areas unacceptable. Hey, it was your decision to hook up with a faith created by a militant nutball pedophile whose revelations came to him while having sex with his nubile bride. It is your choice to defend a faith whose author was a megalomaniac who killed his enemies rather than forgiving them and who had a penchant for going into foaming spittle fits that his friends and family members thought resembled possession. How can a religion created by a demonically possessed or else just nutty as a fruitcake militant radical produce anything but wild-eyed radicalism? Answer: It can't and it hasn't.

You can try to defend the indefensible until your head spins like Linda Blair's (or Muhammad's), but I don't think you are going to win any converts here. Given your cherries jubilee sweetness and light depiction of the antiChrist faith versus what we rational people see with our own eyes and hear with our own ears, which do you imagine we will believe?

You would do well to understand when the time has come to abandon your crusade for Islam and get back to the business of fighting illegal immigration. Failure to win the war against illegal immigration will likely mean that some of the Muslims you lovingly defend will cross the border with one or another WMD and blow one of our cities to Hell.

There is more violence approved in the Bible than in the Koran.

I'm assuming that YOU have studied the Koran.......correct?

In order to make such a statement you would have had to study the koran.

Good! Now please validate the above statement.
{not with quotes from this one or that one as you've been doing which is a non starter--- but with the koran's words}
I mean, since you've studied it & are versed in the writings of mohammed where you are able to make the above statement.

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

There is more violence approved in the Bible than in the Koran.

I'm assuming that YOU have studied the Koran.......correct?

In order to make such a statement you would have had to study the koran.

Good! Now please validate the above statement.
{not with quotes from this one or that one as you've been doing which is a non starter--- but with the koran's words}
I mean, since you've studied it & are versed in the writings of mohammed where you are able to make the above statement.

I find it more than amusing that this fellow refuses to simply acknowledge that he is an adherent of Islam. His posts make the fact quite obvious. His choice to occlude the position from which he makes his strident arguments calls into question his own genuine belief in his viewpoints. In other words, this appears to be a defense for the sake of defense, not a heartfelt and honest deliberation of the facts.

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Radical Christians and radical Muslims.

The actions by Christians are not much different than the acts done by Muslims. Both interpret the Bible and Koran to fit their needs and actions.
At time, the Bible has sanctioned indiscriminate killings, although the command is “thou shall not kill”
God commanded the Israelites to go into the promise land and kill everything living:
Deut 20;16;17..you must not preserve a breathing thing alive..you should without fail devote them to destruction..just as you God has commanded...
Deut 7;16...you must consume all the people..must not feel sorry for them..
Were these Israelite terrorist?
Radical Christians have use these examples as an excuse to kill anyone not like them in race and religion.The Amonites, Hittite, Canaanite, Prizzites, Hivites were no threat except their religious belief. They did not attack the Israelites first. Still God commanded them to be exterminated.
Later when Christ came on the scene things changed, but Christian attitude did not and some have not changed even now.
Very few Christians follow his teachings and interpret the Bible to fit their actions and obey the scriptures as they wish.
1 Pet 2;21...Christ..a model for you to follow...
John 13;15...I set the pattern..
1 John 2;6...he that remains in union with him is under obligation..to go on walking as that one did.
Not many Christians follow Christ as early Christians did who practiced religion as a way of life. Now we do not feel it is a way of life any longer. Government is our way of life.
They obeyed the commandment “thou shall not kill” by not being a part of the Roman army and there are Christians that do not go to war under no circumstances. They believe;
Rom 12;17-19,21...vengeance in mine saith the lord..do not avenge yourself.1 Chro 20;17..you will not need to fight ...stand still and see the salvation of God in you behalf.... Do not be afraid...
Rom 12;17,18..return evil for evil to no one..
Pro 20;22..hope in God and he will save you..
1 Pet 15; Let none of you suffer as a murderer...
Matt 5;44..love you enemy...pray for those that persecute you..

How are we as Christians so different than Muslims who twist and interpret the Koran to fit their actions and needs.There are Christians and Muslims who do not twist the Bible and the Koran to fit their actions.
I’ve read nothing in the Bible that teaches that it is O.K. to war and kill for any reason. It shows that Christians do not believe or have faith in their God.

The most dangerous people on earth are the Evangicals who believe in wars, Jews are God’s chosen people and anything the do is O.K because it must be sanctioned by God. The are against abortions and kill abortion doctors and have no problem sending their children to die and kill other people children. Believe that since he profess to be a Christian that he was placed in office.
I condemn both, radical Christians and radical Muslims. They are alike more than they differ.
Matt 10;28..do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul.
Jude 5...god...saved a people out of Egypt, then destroyed those not showing faith. We are not showing faith in God and he will “bring to ruin, those ruining the earth.”
John 16;2...the hour is coming when everyone that kills you will imagine he has tendered a sacred service to God. They will do these things because they have not come to know either the Father or me...

There is no difference in the use of the Bible and Koran to support violence.
There is more violence approved in the Bible than in the Koran.
The entire population was destroyed during the flood. Jerusalem was destroyed twice. Sodom and Gomorrah destroyed, etc. holy wars was the norm in the old testament. Incest, polygamy, cannibalism, murder and all sorts of atrocities were sanctioned. Pat Robertson and other radical Christian pray for their God to be with Israel and Bush in killing. We force democracy on others countries and killing those who disagree. That is the way radical Christians interpret the Bible and their God and radical Muslims does the same.
Both are wrong and we need to pray they both go away before they destroy us all.Who is the terrorist, the murderer? Bush is as much a terrorist as Bin Laden. We used to call those who disagreed and fought against corruptions “revolutionist” and now we call them “terrorist.” We call our selves "liberators" and those we kill as "colateral damage."

and I am a Christian and I do not believe killing is a necessity in any situation.

[quote:2p0mtj2l]Dyehard, you're just attempting to JUSTIFY by moral equivalency the malignancy of Islam. Are modern Christians beheading men for cutting their beards? Are they denying women the ability to read a book, venture from the home in anything less than a head-to-toes black body condom or stoning them for going to school? Are Christians blowing up buildings, killing innocent women and children in targeted assaults or proclaiming the imminent death of entire peoples or religions?

The answer to each question is a resounding "NO!"


We understand that you are almost certainly a Muslim and that you feel compelled to apologise for the muderous tendencies of your brothers in the faith. But just as a gang member's defense of a fellow gang member for killing a cop or "accidentally" shooting an innocent kid in the head in a drive by is unacceptable, so is defense of the murderous and primitive nutballs who represent the Islamic leadership in many areas unacceptable. Hey, it was your decision to hook up with a faith created by a militant nutball pedophile whose revelations came to him while having sex with his nubile bride. It is your choice to defend a faith whose author was a megalomaniac who killed his enemies rather than forgiving them and who had a penchant for going into foaming spittle fits that his friends and family members thought resembled possession. How can a religion created by a demonically possessed or else just nutty as a fruitcake militant radical produce anything but wild-eyed radicalism? Answer: It can't and it hasn't.

You can try to defend the indefensible until your head spins like Linda Blair's (or Muhammad's), but I don't think you are going to win any converts here. Given your cherries jubilee sweetness and light depiction of the antiChrist faith versus what we rational people see with our own eyes and hear with our own ears, which do you imagine we will believe?

You would do well to understand when the time has come to abandon your crusade for Islam and get back to the business of fighting illegal immigration. Failure to win the war against illegal immigration will likely mean that some of the Muslims you lovingly defend will cross the border with one or another WMD and blow one of our cities to Hell.

[/quote:2p0mtj2l]

I do not defend either radical christians or radical muslims. There are muslims who are my brothers and sisters in the christian religion and I do defend them. Many Muslims have converted to christianity. Your hear and see what you want to see. We are killing innocent men, women and children in Iraq. Any time we, a christian nation, wage war we are going to kill innocent people and there cannot be an excuse.

Originally Posted by dyehard39

I do not defend either radical christians or radical muslims. There are muslims who are my brothers and sisters in the christian religion and I do defend them. Many Muslims have converted to christianity.

Wouldn't that mean they were no longer Muslim???

Your hear and see what you want to see.

Actually I'm hearing and seeing much that I NEVER wanted to, like PC suffocating the very life from this Republic.

We are killing innocent men, women and children in Iraq. Any time we, a christian nation, wage war we are going to kill innocent people and there cannot be an excuse.

We aren't, THEY are. Are U.S. troops becoming suicide bombers? Are we planting IED's? Those are the two things killing the vast majority of the 'innocent'.

Originally Posted by PinestrawGuys

Originally Posted by dyehard39

I do not defend either radical christians or radical muslims. There are muslims who are my brothers and sisters in the christian religion and I do defend them. Many Muslims have converted to christianity.

Wouldn't that mean they were no longer Muslim???

Your hear and see what you want to see.

Actually I'm hearing and seeing much that I NEVER wanted to, like PC suffocating the very life from this Republic. [quote:12irvgfv]We are killing innocent men, women and children in Iraq. Any time we, a christian nation, wage war we are going to kill innocent people and there cannot be an excuse.

We aren't, THEY are. Are U.S. troops becoming suicide bombers? Are we planting IED's? Those are the two things killing the vast majority of the 'innocent'.[/quote:12irvgfv]

That is exactly right Pinestrawguys.

Dyehard, why on earth are you so determined to defend the enemy? Many of these people are willingly blowing themselves up, and many of today's "innocent children" are tomorrow's terrorists. If you had to make a choice between siding with the United States or your Muslim friends, which would it be?

Dyehard,

I sincerely do not think you know who a Christian is.

Oh there has been a wealth of informtion here, deceptive or otherwise, but can you define who a Christian is? Do you know what a Christian believes? Can a Christian be killed???? This Obama presentation seems to have mushroomed or spiraled into a one-sided view in favor of Muslims.

It actually came across to me, in some weird fashion, as a plea or cry from a Muslim to poor pity me.

With all the learned capacity which you seem to portray here, the boat sailed a long time ago.

In the list of Christian "denominations" provided, I believe Mormonism and Jehovah's Witnesses were lumped in there. I think some additional study of Christianity, Mormonism, and Jehovah's Witness is required in order to have a clear factual distinction among the three. That's the least a religion scholar could do. Know from where one speaks.

For the record ... the day that shock and awe began, I watched and I cried. The same way I did when our WTC buildings were flown into by those of the Muslim persuasion who supposedly did so for their glorification and cause. How many other instances have there been whereby Muslims have been involved? Our ship with a hole blown in the side, killing 17 of our sailors. Our embassies. the towers which housed our military, the soldiers killed in Beruit. Just who were the murdering aggressors? Peace loving, huh?

As far as Obama is concerned, "apples don't fall far from the tree."
As for what could a child remember? I'd say lots. (I remember standing in my crib; I remember sunday school nursery classes) Some memories go way back and the influences upon forming children's beliefs, can and are brought to the present more times than not.

American's have been deceived and are being deceived to date. We have had this "political correctness" shoved down our throats to the point of gagging. We're being invaded in more ways than one and have been for quite some time.

I think Mr. Bush said it well this morning, in a half hour televised chat with Mr. Scully of C-span. He was referencing the current southern border invasion and his Comprehesive Guest Worker nonsense. "He said that when people get desparate, they do desparate things." I do believe this was the justification he gave for his proposed deal, as well as his justification as to why "our borders will never be protected" unless it's done his way.

This my way or the highway tune is really getting sour. Obama, muslims? Those are just two additional issues to put frosting on the American's cake at this point in time.

One thing Dyehard, you certainly do have the quality of that good old fashioned "sticktoittiveness!"

There are muslims who are my brothers and sisters in the christian religion and I do defend them.

DYE
Hmmmm, better go and tell your islamic brothers & sisters that while there voices are SILENT, they get NO quarter.

SILENCE is not golden in this instance and they are NOT condeming the damned.

Hey, where are those 10 imams I asked you to find?
SILENCE............speaks volumes, doesn't it?

I find it difficult to fathom that adherents to the religion of one of the antiChrists whose tenets specifically DENY the Christ's claim that no one may enter the Kingdom of Heaven EXCEPT through him could be "brothers and sisters in the Christian religion." Now, if they disavow Islam in favor of Christian doctrine, that's another story, but they are then no longer Muslim, as was pointed out above.