Thread: Can a past of Islam change the path to president for Obama?

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

I do understand where you're coming from, DYE, as I've been there myself. It took many years for me to accept the truth.

Personally, I'll put my experiences over the disinformation that is placed into our airwaves for mass consumption. I know what I've seen with my own eyes and I know a bit of history.

It's amazing, to me, that it's landed on our shores but, alas, it has and turning our backs on truth is destructive.

Again, it is beneficial to inspect CAIR for a great deal of the truth.
Look at the results in europe.
Look at the happenings right here in the U.S.
Look at how the muslims are using our Constitution to, in effect, destroy it.
Eventually, eyes open and the truth is the truth.
No different than the ILLEGALS............who are being used by the islamic maniacs now as another way to infiltrate and do their dirty deeds.[/quo

te]

Where have you been and what experience have you had? You keep lumping Muslilm as a whole and you cannot do that anymore than you can lump all Christians with the KKK or Neo-nazi or all Mexicans with drugs and illegal immigration or all black men as pimps and drug dealers and gang menbers.
Experience can be deceiving. I really does not mean anything. You said it all when you said "Islamic Maniacs" because that set them apart from Muslims that are not radical in belief. All muslim do not have the same beliefs or practice Islam the same.
I feel that I am up against a brick wall.

I don't LUMP anyone together. Please don't label me.
[quote:27glsllb]
However, Islamic law is FACT and that is the only thing that matters when discussing muslims in the US of A much less holding elected office. And yes, all muslims do have the same beliefs. That's the point.
muslims are ruled by islamic law.

[quote:27glsllb]

"All Muslims do have the same beliefs" is way over the top. I would like to know where you got this information from. It is unbelievable that you would even this stero-type beliefs. All Muslims do not practice Islam the same or even interpret the Koran the same. If they did the whole world would be in trouble. Sunni and Shiites even practice Islam different as they interpret it and how it fit their way of life. Same goes for Christianity. Can you same, since all Christians read the same bible, that they all believe the same and interpret the bible the same?
Jihad is...crusade to protect Islamic land, beliefs and institutions..do good works..avoid all evil thoughts, word and deeds. one God..and Muslims are subject ot Sharia and practice according to their interpretations that fit their way of life. Jihad is not practiced the same.Some Christians believe in one God and some believe in the trinity of Gods. Some believe Jesus is not and not the Son of God. Christians beliefs is just too widely different for me to go into.



Where I've been & my experiences would knock your socks off.

Where have you been, DYE, and what experiences have you had?
Are you muslim and are speaking from your personal experiences concerning the "practice" of islamic law? Other than the typical propaganda shmooze pieces that you've offered, what do you know that has formed your beliefs concerning this subject?

[/quote:27glsllb][/quote:27glsllb]

I am not attacking you personally and I should have said "we" as in many views of Americans.
It believe it would take more than you and your experiences to "knock my socks off." My socks are not easily knocked off.
What Muslim countries have you been and again, what are you experiences?
My study of religions of the world has helped and my studies of Islam in Muslimic countries. My studies on Iraqs's history, etc. I have had not had personal experience in Islam. I know propaganda when I hear it.

Originally Posted by Neese

Afro-American

[quote:3nx8istf]
I'm pretty sure "afro" is a hairstyle. But anyway, did you hear about the controversy about teaching little kids about being gay in our public schools? I think that is up to the parents to teach, if and when they choose to, because it is not the norm for our society. What do the rest of you think?

[/quote:3nx8istf]



Afro-Americans; A Black American of African ancestry; an African American The family that raised me preferred to be call Afro-Americans and most that I know prefer it also. Being Native American, I even had one, but It was not easy.
Being gay is a personal choice and is no business of the government or schools. When kids are old enough they will learn about being gay from their peers. I had no training on what is means to be gay. I had and have many gay friends. It is as normal as apple pie. Who is to say if it is right or wrong?


Most Afro-American prefer not to be referred to as "Blacks" because of the negative conotation as in black magic, black sunday, etc. and covers a wide race of people and nationalities and do not set them apart as being descendents of Africa.

Originally Posted by AlturaCt

Debbie Schlussel is a known rasict and she does not hide the fact.

Whoa! You want to prove that?

I know racism when I hear it and her articles if full of racist statements.

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

DYE

Have you every been to Israel?
Have you any experience in the Middle East?

I have.

Have you Lived in all the Muslim countires? Not all of these country's Muslims practice radical Islam. If they did we would we in big stuff.



Muslim Countries of the World
Name Population % of Muslims
1 Afaganistan 18M 99%
2 Albania 2.3M 75%
3 Algeria 22M 98%
4 Bahrain .220M 99%
5 Bangladesh 100M 85%
6 Cameroon 6.2M 55%
7 Central African Republic 2M 55%
8 Chad 4M 85%
9 Dahomey 3M 60%
10 Egypt 51M 93%
11 Ethiopia 27M 65%
12 Gambia .4M 85%
13 Guinea 4.3M 95%
14 Guinea-Bissau .81M 70%
15 Indonesia 161M 95%
16 Iran 48M 98%
17 Iraq 14.5M 95%
18 Ivory Coast 5M 55%
19 Jordan 3M 95%
20 Kuwait 1M 98%
21 Lebanon 3M 57%
22 Libya 3M 100%
23 Malaysia 14.5M 52%
24 Maldive Islands 12M 100%
25 Mali 6M 90%
26 Mauritania 2M 100%
27 Morocco 24M 99%
28 Niger 4.5M 91%
29 Nigeria 100M 75%
30 Oman .75M 100%
31 Pakistan 90M 97%
32 Qatar .18M 100%
33 Saudi Arabia 10.5M 100
34 Senegal 7M 95%
35 Sierra Leone 3M 65%
36 Somalia 5M 100%
37 South Yemen 1.5M 95%
38 Sudan 22M 85%
39 Syria 11M 87%
40 Tanzania 15M 65%
41 Togo 2.1M 55%
42 Tunisia 7M 95%
43 Turkey 66M 99%
44 U.A.E .32M 100%
45 Upper Volta 6M 56%
46 North Yemen 6M 99%


In 1986, the Muslim Education Trust organization (MET) located in the United Kigdom and directed by Ghulam Sarwar, obtained the 1971 census and information given by Embassies of the respective countires in London. The 1971 census showed the Independent Muslim countries population was around 784.5 Million.


Muslim Minority Countries
Country Name Muslims % of total population
Angola 1.5M 25%
Argentina .5M 2%
Ausralia .13M 1%
Bhutan .05M 5%
Botswana .03M 5%
Brazil .21M .2%
Bulgaria 1.3M 14%
Burma 3M 10%
Burundi .7M 20%
Cambodia .07M 1%
Canada .1M .5%
China 100M 11%
Congo .15M 15%
Cyprus .21M 33%
Equatorial Guinea .07M 25%
Fiji .06M 11%
France 2M 3.80%
Germany 1.5M 2.40%
Ghana 3M 30%
Gibraltar .003M 10%
Greece .27M 3%
Hong Kong .004M 1%
Guyana .01M 15%
India 100M 12%
Italy .55M 1%
Japan .01M 1.00%
Kenya 4M 29.50%
Liberia .5M 30%
Lesotho .12M 10%
Malagasy Republic 1.4M 20%
Malawi 1.7M 35%
Malta .045M 14%
Mauritius .14M 19.50%
Mozambique 2.2M 29%
Nambia .034M 5%
Nepal .5M 4%
Netherlands .2M 1.50%
Panama .05M 4%
Phillipines 5M 12%
Portuguese Timor .012M 20%
Reunion .09M 20%
Rumania .2M 20%
Zimbabwe 1M 15%
South Africa .5M 2%
Sri Lanka 1.2M 9%
Surinam .1M 25%
Swaziland .046M 10%
Thailand 6M 14%
Trinidad & Tobago .127M 12%
Uganda 4M 36%
U.K 1.5M 2.70%
U.S.S.R (Russia) 60M 20%
U.S.A 3.2M 1.50%
Yugoslavia 5M 20%
Zaire 2.4M 10%
Zambia .7M 15%

Are you muslim, DYE?

I don't think I saw your answer to that question. If I missed it, I apologize in advance. Would you point me to your answer?

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

Are you muslim, DYE?

I don't think I saw your answer to that question. If I missed it, I apologize in advance. Would you point me to your answer?[/quote

]


If I am Muslim or not has nothing to do with what Islam teaches or beliefs of Muslims in different countries. What is fact has nothing to do with my personal beliefs. I know what Islam and Christianity teaches and how it differently it is practiced.
All of the denominations below practice religion differently.
1. Christianity (see
List of Christian denominations)
Catholicism
Eastern Orthodoxy
Monophysite Oriental Orthodoxy
Nestorianism
Protestantism
Anabaptists
Anglicans
Baptists
Lutherans
Methodists
Pentecostals
Reformed
Presbyterian
Society of Friends (Quakers)
Restorationism
Jehovah's Witnesses
Mormonism
Seventh-day Adventist





2. Islam
Ahmadiyya
Kharijites
Ibadis
Sufris
Nation of Islam
Shiite
Alawites
Ismailis
Jafari
Zaiddiyah
Sunni
Berailvi
Deobandi
Hanafi
Hanbali
Maliki
Mu'tazili
Shafi'i
Wahhabi
Sufism
Zikri
1. Native American religions
Abenaki mythology
Aztec mythology
Blackfoot mythology
Chippewa mythology
Creek mythology
Crow mythology
Guarani mythology
Haida mythology
Ho-Chunk mythology
Huron mythology
Ibo mythology
Iroquois mythology
Kwakiutl mythology
Lakota mythology
Lenape mythology
Navaho mythology
Nootka mythology
Pawnee mythology
Salish mythology
Seneca mythology
Tsimshian mythology
Ute mythology
Zuni mythology

http://open-encyclopedia.com/List_of_religions

1. Western Christianity
Catholicism
Eastern Rite
Latin Rite (Roman Catholicism)
Catholic Charismatic Renewal
Hebrew catholics
Catholics not in communion with Rome
American Catholic Church in the United States
Catholic Apostolic National Church of Brazil
Catholic Apostolic Church
Celtic Catholic Church
Charismatic Episcopal Church
Chinese Patriotic Catholic Association
Free Catholic Church
Liberal Catholic Church
Mariavite Church
Old Catholic Church
Palmarian Catholic Church
Philippine Independent Church
Polish National Catholic Church
Sedevacantism
true Catholic Church
Protestantism
Early Protestantism
Pre-Lutheran Protestants
Hussites
Moravians
Taborites
Unity of the Brethren
Utraquists
Lollards
Waldensians
Puritans
Hebrew Christians
High Protestantism
Anglican Communion
Continuing Anglican Movement
Calvinist sects
Presbyterian
Reformed
Lutherans
Low Protestantism
Baptists (from the Calvinists)
Methodists (from the Anglicans)
Radical Low Protestantism
Anabaptists
Amish
Hutterites
Bruderhof Communities
Mennonites
Apostolic Churches
Brethren Denominations
Church of the United Brethren in Christ
Plymouth Brethren
River Brethren
Schwarzenau Brethren
Social Brethren
Evangelicalism
Salvation Army
Pentecostals and Charismatic
Oneness Pentecostalism
True Jesus Church
Pietists and Holiness Churches
Religious Society of Friends (Quakers)
Restorationism
Adventism
Christadelphians
Iglesia ni Cristo
Jehovah's Witnesses
Latter Day Saints or Mormons
Aaronic Order
Apostolic United Brethren
Church of Christ (Temple Lot)
Church of Jesus Christ (Bickertonite)
Church of Jesus Christ (Cutlerite)
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Strangite)
Church of Christ with the Elijah Message
Community of Christ
Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints
Pentecostal Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints
Restoration Church of Jesus Christ
Restoration Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints
Restored Church of Jesus Christ
Sons Aumen Israel
True and Living Church of Jesus Christ of Saints of the Last Days
Millerites
Seventh-day Adventist
Restoration movement (Campbell)
Churches of Christ
Swedenborgianism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_re ... ristianity

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Have you Lived in all the Muslim countires? Not all of these country's Muslims practice radical Islam. If they did we would we in big stuff.

Dyehard, they may not all practice radical Islam, but most of them defend it over every other faith (take your own desperate defense of it here as an example). And they sure as Hell are not quick to condemn the vicious and murderous acts of the Islamic terrorists. THAT is the problem.

Dyehard, I would like to hear your opinion of terrorism as a means of promoting Islam or punishing her enemies. I would like to hear your opinion as to whether all people should convert to Islam or else be subjects under it. I would like to know whether you believe that Muhammad made a binding command to his followers to spread Islam to every corner of the Earth and to subjugate those not "of the book."

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Originally Posted by dyehard39

Have you Lived in all the Muslim countires? Not all of these country's Muslims practice radical Islam. If they did we would we in big stuff.

Dyehard, they may not all practice radical Islam, but most of them defend it over every other faith (take your own desperate defense of it here as an example). And they sure as Hell are not quick to condemn the vicious and murderous acts of the Islamic terrorists. THAT is the problem.

Dyehard, I would like to hear your opinion of terrorism as a means of promoting Islam or punishing her enemies. I would like to hear your opinion as to whether all people should convert to Islam or else be subjects under it. I would like to know whether you believe that Muhammad made a binding command to his followers to spread Islam to every corner of the Earth and to subjugate those not "of the book."

The majority of Muslims do not DEFEND acts radical Muslims. The majority of Muslims CONDEMN terrorist acts. I do not defend radical muslims and their terrorist acts, but I cannot blame all Muslims for those acts. All people should not convert to Islam or subject to it's laws. Muslim countries have a right to their religion, laws and defend it as we do here in America. We should not attempt to force our beliefs and laws on Muslim countries. I do not believe Muslim preach, as we do, to spread their religious belief. They just want to be left alone to practice as they believe and all not not radical beliefs. We are the ones who want to spread democracy and christianity throughout the world by force.

The Koran does not teach jihad as practiced by radical Muslims.



Muslim Americans Condemn Attack
9/11/2001 - Political Social Religious - Article Ref: AM0109-335
Number of comments: 27
By: American Muslim Leaders
American Muslim Leaders* -
In the Name of Allah, the Compassionate, the Merciful

Dr. Yahia Abdur-Rahman, from the Islamic Shurah Council of Southern California (ISCSC), offers Supplication For The Victims

Dr. Maher Hathout, from the the Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC) and The Islamic Center of Southern California (ICSC), condemns the attack and issues a statement. Click here to listen

Dr. Ahmad Sakr, from the Islamic Education Center (IEC), offers his condolences to the families of the victims and condemns the attack. Click here to listen

Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi, former president of the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), condemns the attack. Click here to listen

________________________________________
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE - 9/11/01
U.S. MUSLIMS CONDEMN TERRORIST ATTACKS

(WASHINGTON, DC - 9/11/2001) - The American Muslim Political Coordination Council (AMPCC), today condemned the apparent terrorist attacks in New York and Washington and offered condolences to the families of those who were killed or injured.
The AMPCC statement read in part:
"American Muslims utterly condemn what are apparently vicious and cowardly acts of terrorism against innocent civilians. We join with all Americans in calling for the swift apprehension and punishment of the perpetrators. No political cause could ever be assisted by such immoral acts."
Leaders of the American Muslim Political Coordination Council (AMPCC) held a meeting in Washington, DC, on Tuesday, September 11, 2001, to issue the following points related to the terrorist attacks:
1) We assert unequivocal condemnation based on our religious values and our identity as American Muslims;

2) We do not need to defend every maniacal incident emanating from the Muslim world or the Muslim community, just as other religious groups need not defend their extremists;

3) We offer compassion to the victims and solidarity with all Americans in the face of danger;

4) Notwithstanding the disbelief that anyone following the faith of Islam could commit such a heinous crime, we condemn the act regardless of the identity of the perpetrators;

5) We deplore the irresponsible reporting that twists the realities and complexities of the Muslim world in order to project only anti-American sentiment during this disturbing period when we are all attempting to move beyond the state of mourning for the national tragedy;

6) We warn against opportunists who will exploit the misery and hysteria of the public in order to promote a political agenda aimed at tarnishing the name of Islam and Muslims;

7) We should not diminish our resolve to be active in protecting the civil liberties of all Americans and struggling for justice both locally and globally;

We need to organize activities to help the victims medically, psychologically and in every other way we can.
________________________________________
American Muslim Alliance (AMA) Condemns Terrorist Attack
(Newark, California: 9/11/01) The American Muslim Alliance, a national civic education organization, condemned today's terrorist attacks in New York and Washington in the "strongest terms".
Dr. Agha Saeed, the national Chair of the American Muslim Alliance, Stated:
"These attacks are against both divine and human laws and we condemn them in the strongest terms. The Muslim Americans join the nation in calling for swift apprehension and stiff punishment of the perpetrators, and offer our sympathies to the victims and their families."

http://www.islamicity.com/articles/Arti ... AM0109-335

Why radical Muslims hate us. It is not because we are a free nation and Christians. If that was the case they would be trying to kill anyone of a free country and they are not doing that. The war on terror is not a global problem. They attacked us wherever we are and we are all over the world. There are many Christians in Muslim countries. The Koran teaches the right to practice religion of your choice and not to force your religious belief on others.
They are attacking(jihad) Israel because Israel took and occupies Palestine land. They are also attacking those who threaten their way of life and religion (Islam) and our presence and occupation on Muslim land. Those in the middle east and policies.
They have every right (jihad) to fight and kill the aggressors that threaten Islam (by forcing democracy) and occupying their land. We would do the same if Muslims invaded America, occupied it and forced Islam on us. Two verses of Sura 2 reads;
There shall be no compulsion in religion. Fight for the sake of Allah those that fight against you, but do not attack them first. Allah does not love the aggressors. (2:190)
Prisoners of war were not to be treated brutally. Prisoners are to be bound, not killed; they may be freed or held for ransom, but only so long as the war continues.
(The Americans who were held hostage in revolutionary Iran from November 1979 to January 1981 were evidently both the victims and the beneficiaries of those instructions. If, as the Iranian extremist believed, the Islamic revolutions was engaged in a struggle with the “great Satan,” the United States, then it was legitimate to take the hostages and bind them or hold them for ransom; but it would have been sinful to kill them.

The rhetoric that it is global is an excuse for our people to try to get other countries involved and go along with us. We want to involve the world but we caused the problem.

There is no "moderate" Islam or "radical" Islam. There is just Islam.

The only difference between so-called radical Muslims and moderate Muslims is that the moderates do not insist upon Sharia Law and do not take to heart Mohammed's command to wage jihad until Islam covers the earth and non Muslims feel themselves subdued (Sura 9:29). And yes--Islam does command this. If Islam cannot be spread by peaceful means, violent jihad is permitted.

The doctrine of jihad to spread Islam is a constant in Islamic theology throughout the ages and has never been repudiated by any school of Islamic jurisprudence. As well, Islam contains codified and detailed laws for conducting warfare in the name of God; something that no other religion can claim.

Islam divides the earth between believer and unbeliever. There are peaceful verses in the Qur'an which are called the "Meccan" verses. These verses came from the beginning of Mohammed's "ministry" when his armies were not yet strong and so were more conciliatory. Later, as his army became stronger, the verses become more violent. These are the Medina verses and they abrogate the more peaceful, earlier Meccan verses.

There are many good and peaceful Muslims in the world; however, Islam, when followed to the letter, is not peaceful as regards non-Muslims. So, the difference is between the ones who practice pure Islam where Sharia is strictly adhered to and "moderate" or secular Muslims who do not follow the Sharia. The problem is knowing which ones are which and when a "moderate" Muslim will be inspired to become more devout and begin to practice pure Islam and follow the Sharia.

Sharia is not compatible with secular, Western democracy. It is a comprehensive political, economic, social belief system as well as a religious one. With Sharia there is no need for man made laws or constitution.

If American foreign policy is soley responsible for the rise of "radical" Islam, then why are Islamists chopping the heads off of Buddhist monks in Thailand and Christian school girls in Indonesia? How about the violence against Christians in Nigeria where the Islamists are trying to impose Sharia Law. There are conflicts all over the world which involve Muslims trying to impose Sharia that have absolutely nothing to do with American foreign policy.

Read: Ayaan Hirsi Ali, a beautiful and brave Muslim woman from Somalia, Robert Spencer, Sharia, dhimmi, taqiyya. There is a lot to know. Remaining in denial about this is not much different than remaining in denial regarding the "reconquista" agenda.