Thread: Barack Obama's citizenship questioned

go to http://khow.com/pages/boyles.html and listen to his July 28, 2009 8:00am++


Published 1 day ago from The Complete Pete
Peter talks with Dr. Jerry Corsi on the legitimacy of President Obama's birth certificate.

tomorrow he will have Lou Dobbs on!!

this really gets me!!!

A close examination of the birth certificates issued by Kapi'olani to the Nordyke twins shows the registration number precedes the number given Obama, even though the future president was born a day earlier.

Susan Nordyke was born at 2:12 p.m. Hawaii time and was given No. 151 – 61 – 10637, which was filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.

Gretchen Nordyke followed at 2:17 p.m. and was given No. 151 – 61 – 10638, which was also filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.

According to a version of Obama's purported short-form certificate available from FactCheck.org, Obama was given a higher registration number than the Nordyke twins. The online image indicates the number is No. 151 – 1961 – 10641, even though he was born Aug. 4, 1961, the day before the twins, and his birth was registered with the Hawaii registrar three days earlier, Aug. 8, 1961.

The middle figure in Obama's purported registration also is different than the Nordykes'. Obama's is 1961, indicating the year, while the Nordykes' is merely 61.

One explanation for the out-of-order serial numbers might be that several serialized stacks of birth certificates were made available at different hospitals.

Another possibility is that Obama's number is not a genuine registration number created in 1961 but was issued when the short-form document was generated during the 2008 presidential campaign.

Eleanor Nordyke told WND she thinks her twins got lower numbers because she went into the hospital Aug. 4, 1961, and was in labor for 20 hours before she delivered. She speculates that Ann Dunham came in after her and was given a later number, even though Dunham's baby was born earlier. Nordyke's twins were not born until the afternoon of the next day.

WND was unable to receive a response from Hawaii officials regarding the state's procedure for issuing registration numbers.

looks A LOT DIFFERENT, KINDA REAL RIGHT? SO WHATS UP WITH BO'S?

FYI

In December I wrote my Senators asking them to question this before certifying the electoral college. Today I received a response from one of them lol

Dear Mrs. Right Wing Extremist: (ok, he used my real name, but what the heck, this is the ONLY alteration I made)



Thank you for contacting me regarding President Obama's citizenship. I appreciate your thoughts on this issue.



As you may know, Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution states that only a natural born Citizen of the United States is eligible to hold the office of the President. The President's birth certificate was verified by the Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, on October 31, 2008. Barack Obama was sworn in as the 44th President of the United States on January 20, 2009.



Again, thank you for contacting me. I hope the information I have provided has been helpful. My website, http://bayh.senate.gov, can provide additional details about my work in the Senate, including legislation and state projects. You can also sign up for occasional email updates. I value your input and hope you will continue to keep me informed of the issues that matter to you.









Office of Senator Evan Bayh
(202) 224-5623
Russell 131
Washington, D.C. 20510

This is part of the continuing discovery and discussion of Obama's birth and first few years of growth. I think some of these events have been provided by FreedomFirst in earlier posts, but this is the WND version.

One missing element, as I recall, is the Dunham/Obama Sr. marriage license. I know I've never seen a copy. The WND article flows by the situation by using the divorce decree as the verification of marriage date.

And, has anyone seen Ann Dunham's high school diploma?

=================

New doubts revealed in Obama's nativity story

School documents show mother left father within weeks of birth
Posted: July 28, 2009 -- 8:54 pm Eastern

By Jerome R. Corsi
© 2009 WorldNetDaily
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=105341

More cracks have appeared in the official story of Barack Obama's family life, with the revelation in school documentation from the University of Washington that Ann Dunham most likely left her husband, Barack Sr., within weeks of the baby's birth.

The official story as presented in his autobiography, "Dreams from My Father," and in various accounts in newspapers and websites supporting Obama conflicts with the results of a careful analysis of the documentary evidence available.

For example, the official story claims Dunham relocated to Seattle late in 1962, but documentary evidence establishes she left Hawaii when she moved to Seattle in August or September 1961, only a few weeks after the birth of Barack Obama Jr.

Likewise, the official story describes how Dunham and Obama Sr. lived as man-and-wife in Hawaii until he left for Harvard to begin the fall term in September 1962. But the documents establish Dunham abandoned Obama Sr. when she left to begin school at the University of Washington in Seattle for the fall term of 1961, which began in September of that year.

The repositioning of the timeline revealed by the school documents may mask a yet undisclosed secret that lies at the heart of the Obama birth certificate controversy.

The Obama long-form original birth certificate continues to be hidden from the public by Obama despite a multitude of requests to make the document public.

But here are a number of critical dates documenting the birth of Barack Obama Jr. from available public records.

* Ann Dunham was born Nov. 29, 1942, according to her original Social Security Card. This would have made her 18 years old at the time Barack Obama Jr. was born.

* Barack Obama Jr. was born Aug. 4, 1961; this would put his date of conception at the earliest on or around Nov. 4, 1960, assuming there was a full nine months of pregnancy.

* Records provided to WND by Stuart Lau, university registrar in the Office of Admissions and Records at the University of Hawaii at Manoa, document that Ann Dunham's first day of instruction at the university was Sept. 26, 1960, less than six weeks before the earliest date Barack Obama, Jr. could have been conceived.

* Ann Dunham and Barack H. Obama, Sr.'s divorce decree states they were married Feb. 2, 1961, in Wailuku, Maui, Hawaii. This would mean Obama's parents were married approximately three months after Barack Obama, Jr. was conceived, if the baby went full-term.

* Instead of staying in Hawaii with her husband and new baby, Ann Dunham began classes at the University of Washington in Seattle in September 1961 for the autumn semester, less than two months after Obama was born. WND confirmed this date with Madolyne Lawson of the Office of Public Records at the University of Washington.

* Ann Dunham took up residence in Seattle at 516 13th Ave. E., according to the 1961 Seattle Polk directory. This residence was torn down in 1985 and is now replaced by twin Capital Park residential towers; the Seattle Polk Directory listing is for a "Mrs. Anna Obama," a variant of her name that most researchers have considered to be Ann Dunham.

Ann Dunham's residence in Seattle, 1961 (Washington State Archives, Puget Sound Branch, King County Assessor Property Record Card collection)

* At most, Barack Obama Sr. and Ann Dunham lived together for approximately eight months, from Feb. 2, 1961, the date of their marriage, until September 1961 when Ann Dunham began her studies at the University of Washington. But there is nothing on the public record to suggest Ann Dunham and Barack Obama Sr. ever lived together again as man and wife.

* There is nothing on the public record to suggest that Ann Dunham's mother, Madelyn Dunham, accompanied her daughter to Seattle in September 1961, even though she was 18 years old and responsible for a baby who was less than two months old.

* There is no evidence on the public record that Obama Sr. ever joined his wife in Seattle. Instead, the public evidence is that Obama Sr. remained in Hawaii, while his wife and infant son established their residence in Seattle.

* Obama Sr. began studies at Harvard University in September 1962, which means Dunham did not return to live in Hawaii until after Obama Sr. had left the islands, never to return to Hawaii again as a resident.

* The same records show Dunham did not resume her studies at the University of Hawaii until April 1963 for the spring semester, when Barack Obama was approximately one year and five months old.

* Dunham and Obama Sr. were divorced Jan. 20, 1964.

The dates appear reliable, especially given the limited documentary evidence available about Barack Obama’s birth circumstances.

Timeline of President Obama's birth

The dates permit the construction of this timeline:


The timeline raises several questions:

1. Were Dunham and Obama Sr. ever very much in love, even at the beginning of their relationship, or was the marriage always one of convenience arranged to mask an inconvenient pregnancy?

2. Did Dunham and Obama Sr. ever live together as man and wife, and if so, what testimony is there from neighbors at the time that would establish their residence address?

3. Was Obama Jr. born in Hawaii, or was he born in Kenya? Could he have been born in Seattle or possibly even in British Columbia?

4. What hospital was Obama Jr. born in, and who was the attending physician? What official records establish these facts?

5. Who are Obama Jr.'s true birthright parents?

6. Why has President Obama prevented the release to the American public of his long-form original birth certificate listing the hospital of his birth, the attending physician and the identity of his parents, as recorded at the time of his birth? What information is on the original, long-form birth certificate that President Obama does not want the American people to see?

Many of these questions should be able to be answered if the American public could authenticate Barack Obama's original long-form birth certificate listing the hospital where he was born, the date and time of the birth, the attending physician and the names of the parents.

This leads to what is perhaps the key question: What is it the White House is determined to hide by refusing to release the president's original long-form birth certificate?

Moreover, while President Obama and his supporters have made many photographs available from his childhood, important gaps remain:

* No photographs have yet surfaced showing Ann Dunham pregnant in 1961.

* No photographs have yet surfaced with Barack Obama Sr. and Ann Dunham with Barack Obama Jr. as an infant in the hospital where he was born.

* No photographs have yet surfaced of Ann Dunham and Barack Obama Sr. with Barack Obama Jr. after the newly born infant was taken home from the hospital.

When and why did Barack Obama Sr. and Ann Dunham separate?

In his autobiography, "Dreams from My Father," Barack Obama Jr. tells the story that his mother and father first separated when Barack Obama Sr. left Hawaii to attend Harvard.

On page 10, Obama presents this version of the story, writing: "He [Barack Obama Sr.] won another scholarship – this time to pursue his Ph.D. at Harvard – but not the money to take his new family with him. A separation occurred, and he returned to Africa to fulfill his promise to the continent. The mother and child stayed behind, but the bond of love survived the distances …" (ellipsis in original)

The Seattle Times, reporting on the Obama family history in April 2008 when Obama was emerging as a frontrunner for the Democratic Party presidential nomination, disclosed that the family separated when Ann Dunham left Hawaii to enter the University of Washington in Seattle. But the paper incorrectly pushed Ann Dunham's relocation to Seattle to 1962.

In the published article, Seattle Times staff reporter Jonathan Martin wrote: "By 1962, Dunham had returned to Seattle as a single mother, enrolling in the UW for spring quarter and living in an apartment on Capital Hill."

This version allows a few more months for the young mother to care for her infant son while living yet with her husband in Hawaii.

On Oct. 21, 2008, the Seattle Weekly published yet a different version of the story: "But [Ann Dunham] returned to live in Seattle around 1962, after Barack was born in August 1961, leaving her husband, Kenya-born Barack Sr., and his newborn namesake in Hawaii."

The assumption in the Seattle Weekly story is that Ann Dunham left the baby with her parents, Stanley Armour Dunham and Madelyn Dunham, who ultimately raised the future president.

Nicole Brodeur, a Seattle Times staff columnist, interviewed Ann Dunham’s high school "best friend" Maxine Box in February 2008.

According to this version, Box last saw Ann Dunham in 1961, "when [Ann Dunham] visited Seattle on her way from Honolulu to Massachusetts, where her then-husband was attending Harvard."

Box also told the Seattle Times that Ann Dunham showed no interest in baby-sitting when they were in college, suggesting she was surprised when Dunham ended up pregnant only a year after graduating from Mercer Island High School.

"[Dunham] felt she didn't need to date or marry or have children," Box recalled for the Seattle Times interview published in March 2007.

Then, commenting on the birth of Barack Obama Jr., Box said, "I just couldn't imagine [Ann Dunham's] life changing so quickly.".

Unfortunately for Box, Barack Obama Sr. still was in Hawaii; he did not leave for Harvard until the following year.

In an unusual video now removed from the Internet, Ann Dunham's high school friend Susan Blake also claimed Dunham visited Seattle in August 1961 with her infant son. Blake said she changed the baby's diapers. The video is still noted and transcribed as footnote No. 21 in Ann Dunham's Wikipedia entry.

What Ann Dunham was doing in Seattle immediately after her baby was born is unclear, unless she was there to find an apartment so she could start school in September 1961 at the University of Washington.

Others have speculated that perhaps Barack Obama Jr. was born in Seattle, or possibly in Canada, allowing Dunham to be in Seattle immediately after the future president's birth without having to fly from Hawaii to the mainland sometime between Aug. 4, 1961, when the baby was born, and September 1961 when the fall term began at the University of Washington.

Barack Obama Jr.'s babysitter in Seattle

Mary Toutonghi, according to an interview published in the Seattle Chat Club blog, claimed to have baby-sat for the future president at Dunham's Seattle apartment in January and February 1962. The Toutongi interview provides no information about Dunham arriving in Seattle to begin classes in September 1961.

When asked why Dunham left her husband in Hawaii to come to Seattle with her infant son, Toutongi explained Dunham told her that she and the baby would be going to Kenya when she finished her education, as she had promised her parents when she was married.

Toutongi also added Dunham's explanation that her husband had an obligation to his tribe to take another wife that was a full-blooded Kenyan. Toutongi further commented, "I don't think I could have been that brave."

In an interview with WND, Toutongi said she baby-sat for infant Obama "for two or there months, when he was seven months old," adding "it was in the spring."

Given Obama’s birth on Aug. 4, 1961, this would put the dates Toutongi baby-sat infant Obama in February and March 1962.

"My daughter was 18 months old and she just had her 50th birthday this year," Toutongi recalled. "So, that would make the time around February and March 1962."

"Ann Dunham and the baby moved in while we were there," she remembered. "We managed the house and they had the rooms on the first floor to the right, immediately above the garage. Each of the rooms on that floor comprised a one-bedroom apartment. I can't remember when she moved in, but the baby was seven months old."

"It was kind of weird, but she never told me why she abandoned her husband," she commented. "I don't know if the courses she wanted were here. I couldn't figure out why she was here in Seattle while her husband was in Hawaii."

Did Barack Obama Sr. and Ann Dunham ever live as man and wife?

WND has previously reported the birth notices for Barack Obama Jr. that were published in the Honolulu Advertiser and the Star-Bulletin in 1961 do not provide solid proof of a birth in Hawaii because of uncertainties over the policies and procedures used by the newspapers at that time.

WND hired a private investigator in Hawaii to seek out neighbors who lived in 1961 adjacent to 6085 Kalanianaole Highway, the address listed in the newspaper published birth notices.

According to an affidavit filed with WND by the private investigator, Beatrice Arakaki was a neighbor who has lived at her current residence of 6075 Kalanianaole Highway from before 1961 to the present.

Arakaki did not recall the Obama family living in the neighborhood, and she was unaware of any young couple living at 6085 Kalanianaole Highway that met the Obama family description.

If Barack Obama Sr. and Ann Dunham lived at this address when Barack Obama Jr. was born, the original long-form birth certificate should confirm this address as the residence of the baby at birth.

The Hawaii short-form Certification of Live Birth lists no residence address information.

Obama's birth certificate is not the only document at issue. WND has reported that among the documentation not yet available for Obama includes his kindergarten records, Punahou school records, Occidental College records, Columbia University records, Columbia thesis, Harvard Law School records, Harvard Law Review articles, scholarly articles from the University of Chicago, passport, medical records, files from his years as an Illinois state senator, Illinois State Bar Association records, any baptism records and his adoption records.

RELATED

Born in the U.S.A.

http://www.alipac.us/ftopict-164894.html

RELATED

Obama and the 'birthers' - a never-ending battle?

http://www.alipac.us/ftopict-164784.html

RELATED

Hawaii: Obama birth certificate is real

http://www.alipac.us/ftopict-164760.html

Anti-Obama 'birther movement' gathers steam

Conspiracy theory returns with a vengeance as right wing questions Barack Obama's US citizenship

Comments 141
Chris McGreal in Washington guardian.co.uk,
Tuesday 28 July 2009 18.42 BST


Barack Obama speaks at the White House. Photograph: Mark Wilson/Getty

It's not because the president is black, of course.

It's because those upstanding Americans who cheered as Barack Obama's predecessor rode roughshod over the constitution in his war on terror have found a new enthusiasm for a strict adherence to the US's supreme law. Specifically they're interested in a clause requiring the president to be born a natural born citizen (although that doesn't mean to say they're not still worried about Obama also being a secret Muslim).

A long brewing conspiracy theory has it that Barack Obama entered this world as a subject of the British crown in East Africa because his father was Kenyan. A Hawaii birth certificate and birth notices in the Honolulu press went some way to dampen down the feverish speculation when it first emerged during Obama's election campaign, driven by a handful of rightwingers who helped scupper John Kerry's bid for president.

But now the issue has returned with a vengeance driven in part by a high profile CNN presenter, rightwing talk radio and a video of a woman haranguing her Republican member of congress prompting her supporters to recite the Pledge of Allegiance. Now members of congress are sponsoring a bill to require all future presidential candidates to show their birth certificates.

At the heart of the supposed conspiracy is Obama's failure to produce a paper version of his birth certificate because Hawaii digitalised its original records some years ago and now provides a print out of the electronic record. That print out shows he was born in Honolulu in 1961, a fact that was verified again today by the state's health director, Dr Chiyome Fukino. He said: "I ... have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen."

But that is not good enough for what has become known as the birther movement which would have the world believe that Obama was born in Kenya and smuggled in to the country by his American mother, or some variation on that theme.

In recent days the issue has been fired up again by television and radio. The CNN news presenter, Lou Dobbs, who is openly hostile to the new administration, drew attention when he told viewers that the question of Obama's place of birth "hasn't been dealt with". The influential right wing talk show host, Rush Limbaugh, told listeners last week that the president ‚ "has yet to have to prove that he's a citizen".

But the real impact has been a video that has garnered hundreds of thousands of hits on the web. It shows a Republican congressman, Mike Castle, addressing a town hall meeting on health care in Delaware last month when a woman suddenly stands up waving a bunch of papers. She says this is her birth certificate and demands to see the president's. "He is not an American citizen, he is a citizen of Kenya," she shouts to applause from others in the audience. Castle insists that Obama was indeed born an American. The crowd boos. As the congressman tries to change the subject, the woman suddenly demands everyone recites the Pledge of Allegiance. The entire hall stands, faces the US flag, place their right hand on their hearts and begins reciting the pledge.

The encounter was a warning to Republican officials how far the conspiracy theory has permeated parts of their party. The incident reflected an undercurrent of suspicion about Obama among those who see him as somehow un-American because of his politics or race, aside from the theory that he is a secret Muslim because his middle name is Hussein. Other Republicans have taken note: Ten members of Congress are sponsoring legislation to force future presidential candidates to find their birth certificates - widely seen as a tacit endorsement of the conspiracy theorists.

One of the sponsors, John Campbell, was asked in a television interview if he believes the president is an American and was mocked for replying: "As far as I know." Other members of Congress have been hit with wads of "evidence" and demands for meetings by supporters of the birther movement.

The origins of the birther movement are murky but among those who played a leading role in getting it noticed is Andy Martin, a former Republican congressional candidate and open antisemite who has denounced Jews for secretly controlling the country. He helped drive the rumours that Obama was a secret Muslim who renounced US citizenship at the age of 10 while living in Indonesia. Martin filed a lawsuit last year demanding the Hawaii authorities verify his birth certificate.

There is also Jerome Cors who co-authored the Swift Boat book that questioned John Kerry's war record when he was running for president. Cors claims Obama's birth certificate is a forgery. He also writes for World Net Daily, a supposed news site that offers for sale bumper stickers demanding to know "where's the birth certificate?" and a DVD called A Question Of Eligibility: Is Obama's Presidency Constitutionally Legitimate?

Orly Taitz, a Russian born resident of California who describes herself as an attorney and dentist, has come to the forefront as an agitator on her blog and at meetings.

The tone of the questioning has raised unease at major networks. Dobbs' own producers have expressed concern over his repeated dwelling on the question of Obama's origins.

Joe Klein, president of the US wing of CNN, wrote to them to say that "it seems this story is dead — because anyone who still is not convinced doesn't really have a legitimate beef". But Klein later said he wasn't ordering Dobbs to stop talking about it.

The president of MSNBC, Phil Griffin, took a tougher line. He told the New York Times that the questioning is driven by the fact that America has elected a black president: "It's racist. Just call it for what it is."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/ju ... itizenship

Has anyone seen Bush's birth certificate ?

I haven't.

He must be hiding something.

He would show it to me if he wasn't.

Originally Posted by AirborneSapper7

Anti-Obama 'birther movement' gathers steam

Conspiracy theory returns with a vengeance as right wing questions Barack Obama's US citizenship

Comments 141
Chris McGreal in Washington guardian.co.uk,
Tuesday 28 July 2009 18.42 BST

Pure Brit 'rubbish.'