Thread: BP CHIEF SAYS BP NOT TO GET ILLEGALS!

Originally Posted by SOSADFORUS

This was just on FOX news and the guy said the news papers misconstrued what he said

Do you suppose the friends of illegal aliens in the town hall misconstrued what he said? No, they got the message, regardless of his later clarifications.

Way too much of this. The pols say one thing in Spanish, then deconstruct what they said to us in English. They learned to do that from Yasser Arafat.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

USPatriot, it wouldn't surprise me if Carrillo has ties to the other side of the border. That is often the case with these people who say stupid things like that. There are several congressmen, mayors, etc. along the TX border who are clearly more sympathetic to the illegals than they are to Americans. They are supposed to BE Americans to have those jobs at all but apparently they are torn between loyalties.

Just wait until we are attacked by terrorists who have become U.S. citizens, who have sworn allegiance to the United States and renounced foreign allegiances, but who retain a "higher loyalty" to a certain cult of terror, violence, kidnapping, murder, intimidation, extortion, war, and conquest, which masquerades as a "religion".

"Beware of false prophets. . . You will know them by their fruits." (Matthew 7:15,16)

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

I'm thinking that if a person with Mexican ties truly wants a job as Border Patrol, they should be sent far away from the border to work because the temptation is always going to be there to do or say the wrong thing.

No can do, JuniusJnr. Most of the U.S. Border Patrol agents in the field are Mexicans, who:

• are bilingual,
  
  understand how border jumpers think,
  
  know the local coyotes, sympathizers, and safe houses,
  
  know the back roads, cow paths, and local geography,
  
  will work all night and put their lives on the line for $20K-$30K a year, and
  
  will put up with Señor Coyote shooting out all the windows of their houses and threatening their kids walking to school.

The last I heard. BP agents were on both borders, not just the Mexican border. And if customs agents fall under the auspices of BP, they are also in every single airport that receives international flights. And I know there are BP agents in many TX cities that are hundreds of miles from the border as well as cities in CA, AZ, and NM that aren't exactly on the border, either.

Also, the last I heard, in the El Paso sector of the Border Patrol, the starting pay is around 70K a year. This according to different people we know whose kids who rgot jobs on the BP within the past 2 years. Furthermore, if this isn't true, I'd sure like to know how Agent Ramos afforded the house they had because you don't buy those houses on 30K and I am quite familar with that neighborhood. Not that I think Ramos is guilty of anything illegal.

Finally, if the BP agents actually know all those things you mentioned, (and I agree that in many cases it is probable) doesn't that seem highly suspicious to you? If they know the coyote, why don't they arrest him? Problem solved. If they know the cartel members, why aren't they in jail? Another problem solved. As for the bullets in the windows at night, everyone who lives anywhere near the hardened criminal element amongst gang members is subject to that sort of horror at any moment. My solution to that is to charge anyone caught dealing drugs with mass murder and sentence any gang member to immediate deportation unless they have committed an executable crime. I can assure you that people who live in the middle of them stay inside at night and put their chairs as far away from the windows as possible.

So, as I said, better to let strangers discover these illegals and do the right thing than let their relatives and sympathizers wink and nod them in. Send the border born agents elsewhere and import people who have no ties across the border then keep swapping them around periodically. And, yes, it can be done. Anyone can learn Spanish and most people have to learn it in school these days whether they want to or not.

The pols say one thing in Spanish, then deconstruct what they said to us in English.

I have to agree that this is probably the case. Even though Mexican-style Spanish is vastly different from Castilian Spanish, I was at a meeting one night where even I knew enough Spanish to know that only about 1/10 of a statement made by a Mexican man (supposedly an American citizens but he refused to speak English!) was actually translated for the benefit of the English speaking people. The rest was editorialized by the translator for some odd reason and I don't think it was a mistake.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

The last I heard. BP agents were on both borders, not just the Mexican border. And if customs agents fall under the auspices of BP, they are also in every single airport that receives international flights. And I know there are BP agents in many TX cities that are hundreds of miles from the border as well as cities in CA, AZ, and NM that aren't exactly on the border, either.

Obviously, JuniusJnr. You know what I meant: BP agents on or near the Mexican border.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

Also, the last I heard, in the El Paso sector of the Border Patrol, the starting pay is around 70K a year. This according to different people we know whose kids got jobs on the BP within the past 2 years. Furthermore, if this isn't true, I'd sure like to know how Agent Ramos afforded the house they had because you don't buy those houses on 30K and I am quite familiar with that neighborhood. Not that I think Ramos is guilty of anything illegal.

I stand corrected. I was mistaken. I assumed, incorrectly, that BP agent pay was comparable to my local sheriff's deputy pay. Also, I misunderstood the following discussion about a cap on overtime pay; assuming that your pay range is correct, the $30,000 cap mentioned below only refers to overtime pay, not total pay.

Originally Posted by http://local2544.org/

* OT Cap - Aguilar stated that he did not "lower" the OT cap to $30,000, rather, he instituted "internal" control measures that kicked in at $30,000 and require a specific waiver from him. We will survey agents the rest of this year to verify if they have their OT stopped at $30,000. After this segment of his presentation ran, most agents in the room agreed with him and stated he didn't lower the cap. We must point out that we have been told by a number of Sector managers over the last few months that the "cap" is "$30,000". We chose not to call them out at the meeting and we just let it go. We'll see what happens down the road with this issue when and if agents start getting their OT cut off at $30,000. Here is a direct quote from Aguilar's memo: "Although the earnings limit is statutorily limited to the $35,000 limit, I am instituting internal control measures limiting the earnings cap for all Border Patrol employees." Further, on April 4, 2007 we got a memorandum signed by our current DCPA that states "Although the earnings limit is statutorily limited to $35,000, Office of Border Patrol has limited the overtime (OT) earnings to $30,000." The memo goes on to state "Crucial information for FY 2007: OBP OT cap limit - $30,000". You figure it out. If Aguilar's own top sector managers were confused, you can only imagine the confusion most rank-and-file agents felt.

OK, now I have conceded one point to you, JuniusJnr. Favor me in return with the following point to me.
The BP wants locals on the line, in order to use their knowledge of the local people and the local terrain.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

Finally, if the BP agents actually know all those things you mentioned, (and I agree that in many cases it is probable) doesn't that seem highly suspicious to you?

That isn't suspicious to me at all; it's just good use of intel and experience.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

If they know the coyote, why don't they arrest him? Problem solved. If they know the cartel members, why aren't they in jail? Another problem solved.

It is not an everyday event to nab a coyote. We might turn over two or three hundred illegal alien travelers without ever seeing a coyote. A group of 15 travelers might be five here, five a hundred yards away, and five more a hundred yards behind. The coyote is listening to our radio comms continuously, but we don't understand his click and beep codes on the same frequency.

Everyone knows Señor Coyote; he is the only man in town with any money, he drives a new truck, he is on the town council. But catching him in the act of smuggling dope and/or illegal aliens, with incontrovertible evidence, is difficult. He doesn't carry the drugs on his person; he has mules. He doesn't stay with the travelers if they are spotted; he runs for cover, and we can't shoot him, corner him, or even touch him. He signals an escape car to meet him on some dirt road who knows where, and he escapes scotfree and unidentified. He abandons his cargo vehicle; it yields no prints, and it was stolen anyway. Even if he is nabbed, he is well-connected; he has the best lawyer in the county; he can buy off jurors; he will never do time.

But those are just excuses for the ones that got away. BP, working in close cooperation with our local group, has arrested a few local coyotes. I don't even want to know about the consequences of the subsequent jury trials.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

As for the bullets in the windows at night, everyone who lives anywhere near the hardened criminal element amongst gang members is subject to that sort of horror at any moment. . . I can assure you that people who live in the middle of them stay inside at night and put their chairs as far away from the windows as possible.

"Everyone who lives anywhere near"? When a coyote gets busted, every window within a half a mile may get busted. And those who live there are in no hurry to put in new glass, because that just invites more vandalism.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

My solution to that is to charge anyone caught dealing drugs with mass murder and sentence any gang member to immediate deportation unless they have committed an executable crime.

Those are admirable sentiments; more power to you. If you get involved in putting those sentiments into action, pm me and I will send you money to encourage your efforts, JuniusJnr.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

So, as I said, better to let strangers discover these illegals and do the right thing than let their relatives and sympathizers wink and nod them in. Send the border born agents elsewhere and import people who have no ties across the border then keep swapping them around periodically.

I understand your reasoning, but that's not how things are done. The BP considers the benefit of local experience and local acquaintances to outweigh the cost of local corruption. These are, after all, the good guys in the BP caps, and we trust that their benefits outweigh their liabilities. Importing people and relocating families are more expensive than using locals. To catch a bootlegger, it takes an ex-bootlegger who knows the ropes, the back roads, and the local people involved.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

And, yes, it can be done. Anyone can learn Spanish and most people have to learn it in school these days whether they want to or not.

Keep on adding training requirements, JuniusJnr, and you will make it even more difficult to hire a non-Hispanic from out of state at a salary competitive with the local BP agent's expectations. When two coyotes with machetes are in the brush, who do you want listening to the radio? The white guy from Illinois with three years of high school Spanish, or the local who has spoken Spanish all his life and understands the local idiom, even under stress and in danger, when it all sounds like jibber-jabber?

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

Originally Posted by MinutemanCDC_SC

The pols say one thing in Spanish, then deconstruct what they said to us in English.

I have to agree that this is probably the case. Even though Mexican-style Spanish is vastly different from Castilian Spanish, I was at a meeting one night where even I knew enough Spanish to know that only about 1/10 of a statement made by a Mexican man (supposedly an American citizen, but he refused to speak English!) was actually translated for the benefit of the English speaking people. The rest was editorialized by the translator for some odd reason, and I don't think it was a mistake.

JuniusJnr, I think we're in sufficient agreement to let go of any remaining differences, in the interests of putting forward ideas that will help to stop the invasion of illegal aliens. Thank you for your post.

OK, now I have conceded one point to you, JuniusJnr. Favor me in return with the following point to me.
The BP wants locals on the line, in order to use their knowledge of the local people and the local terrain.

OK, I agree that the Border Patrol is taking the lazy way out and risking border security in the process. How's that? I vehemently disagree with the idea of having Border Patrol agents with any ties whatsoever to Mexico working on the US/Mexican border.

While I agree that 3 years of high school spanish does not constitute speaking Spanish or any description, there are American citizens of Cuban and Puerto Rican descent who were born speaking street Spanish with no ties across the Mexican border who could fill those jobs. In fact, they would be more likely to want their American relatives who have had to fight their way into society's graces to get those American jobs. Doing that would take away a lot of temptation and, if you listened to the local news from border towns, you would know that the temptation is great.

Do you live on the border, Minuteman? I've spent more years living there than I care to even think about at this point. If you live there, you know the corruption that has crept into border town politics in the form of nepotism and greed because of the groups that strive to get more and more people of Mexican descent into public offices. The city of El Paso's council is a joke! It is my understanding that Laredo and Del Rio are even worse. Some border towns conduct their business only in Spanish, sending a clear signal that non-Mexican Americans aren't even welcome there.

I started fighting over this issue long before the Minuteman Project was ever conceived. When the first MM Project came down, I spent a lot of hours e-mailing and calling news, TV and radio sources all over the country to let them know that the people of this country were tired of the invasion of illegal aliens and that the Minutemen were going to the border. I knew who Tom Tancredo was and his views about the illegal border crossings way before that.

The reason for my concern back in the early 1990's? Because I never want to see a day come when I am the only person in the grocery store or Wal Mart who speaks English. I never want to see a day come when waiters and waitresses or store clerks dare to discriminate against Americans on American soil because they don't speak Spanish. I never want a day to come when I can't get a job in North Carolina, or Vermont, or Indiana because I don't speak Spanish. Let's face it, people whose job is to serve the public in The United States of America should be serving those customers in English. If they speak another language, fine, but English should be the official language and Americans should never have to bow and scrape to people who are here illegally in order to get customer service.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

OK, I agree that the Border Patrol is taking the lazy way out and risking border security in the process. How's that? I vehemently disagree with the idea of having Border Patrol agents with any ties whatsoever to Mexico working on the US/Mexican border.

Originally Posted by MinutemanCDC_SC

I understand your reasoning, but that's not how things are done. The BP considers the benefit of local experience and local acquaintances to outweigh the cost of local corruption. These are, after all, the good guys in the BP caps, and we trust that their benefits outweigh their liabilities. Importing people and relocating families are more expensive than using locals. To catch a bootlegger, it takes an ex-bootlegger who knows the ropes, the back roads, and the local people involved.

JuniusJnr, I live in SC, as my nick indicates. I wouldn't live on the border if you paid me, or even as near as San Antonio or Tucson.

Originally Posted by JuniusJnr

USPatriot, it wouldn't surprise me if Carrillo has ties to the other side of the border. That is often the case with these people who say stupid things like that. There are several congressmen, mayors, etc. along the TX border who are clearly more sympathetic to the illegals than they are to Americans. They are supposed to BE Americans to have those jobs at all but apparently they are torn between loyalties. I'm thinking that if a person with Mexican ties truly wants a job as Border Patrol, they should be sent far away from the border to work because the temptation is always going to be there to do or say the wrong thing.

It's already happened JJ:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 01525.html

The BP has corruption problems. All you have to do is google border patrol corruption and you'll get HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of hits.

JuniusJnr wrote:
USPatriot, it wouldn't surprise me if Carrillo has ties to the other side of the border. That is often the case with these people who say stupid things like that. There are several congressmen, mayors, etc. along the TX border who are clearly more sympathetic to the illegals than they are to Americans. They are supposed to BE Americans to have those jobs at all but apparently they are torn between loyalties. I'm thinking that if a person with Mexican ties truly wants a job as Border Patrol, they should be sent far away from the border to work because the temptation is always going to be there to do or say the wrong thing.


It's already happened JJ:

Oh, I know very well that it is already happening.
I don't know if you are familiar with the congressman Sylvestre Reyes who constantly brags that he was on the border patrol and even the head of the el paso sector for 26 years. Well, he has ties to that other side of the border and I'd venture to guess that about ten million of the thirty million people who are in this country illegally came when he was in charge with his back turned.

The El Paso papers are filled with stories of BP Agents gone astray. That is why I think that any agent who has ties across the border should be working on the opposite border and that they should all be swapped around periodically so that they can't be in any one place long enough to be seduced by the power the possess to allow or deny entry with a wink or a nod.