Thread: RIDDLE ME THIS, BATMAN

Originally Posted by Judy

The standing "scholarly" theory which "scholars" are still investigating...not just SIXX, not just me...is that Mexico exterminated its black population through inter-marriage. The Blacks in Mexico believe they are still "there" but not being counted which in "their" words, not SIXX's, not mine, but "theirs" is that this is "worst than racism".

Even if there were a deliberate effort to exterminate blacks through intermarriage, it seems silly to regard this as terribly wicked since it's an absolute inevitability that two ethnic groups, residing together, will blend together with one another with two resultant possibilities. The first possibility is that a new hybrid population will eventually emerge whose characteristics depend on the numbers of the two ethnic groups involved in addition to genetic dominance and recessiveness of those two ethnic groups. The second possibility, which is what I believe is taking place in Mexico, is that one ethnic group will be submerged into the other.

This is an "anomaly", a unique phenomena in Mexico that creates a serious question about What Happened to the Blacks in Mexico?

But it's not. The island of Japan was once inhabited by the Ainu. The Ainu ( those few hundred who remain distinctly Ainu) are quite distinct from the Japanese. But because these two ethnic groups resided together, they blended. The result was the effective extinction of the Ainu there. Multiple ethnic groups simply cannot occupy the same territory for a long period of time.

There should be a probe into What Happened to the Blacks in Mexico.

Why does it matter to Sixx, to me, to ALIPAC, to our fight against illegal immigration?

Because....the opposition, our enemy uses a "race card" to defeat any attempts to stop illegal immigration. These "race cards" are thrown by Hispanics, representing through this organization and that organization, all 501 C 3 "public charities", that to be opposed to illegal immigration makes you a "racist".

This indictment of "racism" is totally illegitimate. To defeat it, it shouldn't be charged with any legitimacy whatsoever. Rather than making the recrimination of racism against them, simply explain why it's illegitimate.
Moreover, the word "racism" itself has very little meaning.

Yet...the Mexican Government and the Nation of Mexico is truly racist...we know that from its history to "breed out" Blacks by inter-marriage an idea we learned yesterday that was introduced by the Catholic Church Bishop.

As I said, it's an absolute inevitability that ethnic groups, residing together, will begin to blend. This will happen without exception.

Yet...the Blacks still in Mexico are huddled in poor villages in remote areas along the western coasts...descendants of fugitives and run-away slaves...that is why it appears they exist today...their forefathers escaped, raising the question where are the descandants of the slaves that DID NOT ESCAPE?

Yet...we learn that an amazing "anomaly" exists in Mexico with respect to its Black Population. They are all gone. Where did they go? What happened to them? Why ONLY in Mexico did a race of people virtually disappear when they did not disappear anywhere else?

Suppose that you're right. Suppose that many blacks in Mexico were actually murdered. When would this have taken place? A hundred years ago? Would contemporary Mexicans be responsible for this at all? No.

There is no evidence that a Black Population would be genetically exterminated. Perhaps this is the case, but there is no evidence of this and there is no reason to believe that this accounts for the virtual disappearance of this population from Mexico, because it is unique to Mexico.

I submit to you, again, that the evidence lies in a biological principle. It's a certainty that blacks and whatever ethnic groups they resided with blended in Mexico. It seems to me that this is what most likely reduced the numbers of blacks in Mexico (and what will result in their eventual disappearance there).

More photographs of clearly mixed Mexican blacks:

http://www.afromexico.com/horse.jpg
http://www.afromexico.com/pocitos.jpg

And a photograph of black children with mestizo children (which means that they indeed do reside together):

http://www.afromexico.com/mango.jpg

This is a legitimate issue both to understand what atrocities or anomalies occurred in Mexico with respect to their Black Population, but to understand the attitudes of the millions of Mexicans entering the United States with totally racist attitudes towards millions of Black Americans.

Immigration policy must forbid the entry of those with racist attitudes. We have "enuf" of that already. In addition, importing this level of wicked racism which is beginning to appear worse than what exists in the United States puts millions of Black Americans AT RISK.

Well, I don't disbelieve that many Mexicans treat blacks with racism here. But what examples of this do you have? I'm curious.

Originally Posted by Acebackwords

I don't know much about race and genetics, but this Crackbone sounds a little cracked. The "submergence" of blacks? I don't know if this is relevant, but I once saw a couple -- black father, white mother -- who had twins and one of the twins looked completely white and the other looked completely black. Plus, theres all sorts of recessive genes.

Racial characteristics do not really completely develop till maturity. When the second child who looks completely white now matures, I expect that he will seem less white.

The dominance and recessiveness of genes is important, but it would not have prevented the submergence of the black population into the mestizo and Red Indian populations which both in aggregate certainly preponderated blacks in number in Mexico.

Is Crackbone arguing that all races are going to merge into one bland gray mulatto tone? THat seems highly unlikely, any moreso than all the distinct breeds of dogs suddenly blending into one kind of dog.

What I'm arguing is that distinct races of men whose members live among each other will eventually, without exception, blend together. This is why I believe that the number of blacks in Mexico was reduced and why they will eventually disappear there. If all breeds of dogs occupied the same territory and if their breeding weren't directed by man, then exactly the same would happen with them.

I don't argue that *all* races will merge with each other. But it's true that the ones whose members reside together eventually will.

CRACKBONE--

I'm not jumping into the black skin argument but I think SIXX is a farce. I really don't like the way he is belittling your assessment while boasting about fake qualifications. Just for your edification--a CERTIFIED SURGICAL TECHNICIAN is a one or two year TECHNICAL degree. No 4 year liberal arts degree. CERTAINLY, no MED SCHOOL degree. Knows how to hand a scalpel to the SURGEON and sterilize the equipment. That's about the extent of his "world class Medical Pro" claim. Also, he can't spell! The correct spelling of "cradel" is CRADLE. And, it is not ITATLY.

Continue with your techinical argument now!!!

This is a personal attack on SIXX. NOT ALLOWED! Period. Your comments should have been sent in a private message to Crackbone. For those of us that like and respect Sixx's opinion your statement was offensive. How's my spelling? Satisfactory?

What in the WORLD did they do to reduce an entire group of Black Mexicans to nothing more than an Pickinniny Remembrance on a Postage Stamp by 2005?

With all the murders going on even now in Mexican cities in broad daylight, why does anyone even ask the question? Surely it must have occured to you they are being gunned down in the streets and buried in mass graves?

That's what I think. If no one is in control of the law, then the lawless are in control................

Crackbone: Again, I have no particular expertise in this subject, but I think you're missing a key point. To a certain degree theres no such thing as distinct and separte races. Its more like a band from total black to total white with endless shades of gray in between. Or, more to the point, like the spectrum of colors. We can arbitrarily pick out a certain number of "primary" colors -- red, yellow, green, etc -- but this is just an arbitrary and artificial classification. You could slice up the colors any which way in any number of shades. So too, with the different races. You can slice it up any which way with "primary" races: asian, aryan, black, whatever. But my point is: Its ALREADY a blend. Myself. my mothers father was mostly full-blooded native american indian, two generations later, my brothers and sisters have had most of the american indian "washed out" of our appearance, but you can still see it if you're looking for it. And i still have the potential -- though statistically unlikely -- to sire a child who looks 100% American indian, don't I?

Crackbone: ANd as to your comment that "racial characteristics don't really develop until maturity"....well, that might be true. This friend of mine, white woman, had a baby with a very Mexican-looking Mexican father. Last I saw the baby when she was about 7 she looked like a little blonde Shirley Temple. I was surprised when my friend sent me a photo of the girl when she was 15 and she looked like a dark-skinned Latina. But back to my original premise: black father, white mother, twins; one that looked completely white and the other that looked completely black: What proof, other than your opinion do you have that when the babies mature the white one will look blacker or isn't it just as likely that the black one could look whiter? Here in the Bay Area, one of the star high school basketball players was Jason Kidd: same deal, black father, white mother; and he looks about 90% white. I don't think your theory holds water. It could go either way.

Originally Posted by Acebackwords

Crackbone: Again, I have no particular expertise in this subject, but I think you're missing a key point. To a certain degree theres no such thing as distinct and separte races.

Of course there are distinct races. If there weren't, then we wouldn't be discussing blacks in Mexico. If they weren't distinct, then they would be indistinguishable from the other populations of Mexico.

Its more like a band from total black to total white with endless shades of gray in between. Or, more to the point, like the spectrum of colors. We can arbitrarily pick out a certain number of "primary" colors -- red, yellow, green, etc -- but this is just an arbitrary and artificial classification.

Well, what classifications aren't artificial? Does this mean that blacks aren't distinct from, for example, Japanese? No.

You could slice up the colors any which way in any number of shades. So too, with the different races. You can slice it up any which way with "primary" races: asian, aryan, black, whatever. But my point is: Its ALREADY a blend.

You're arguing something entirely different here. I'm arguing that distinct populations will inevitably blend together if they reside together. But is a Central American Red Indian really a "blend"?

Myself. my mothers father was mostly full-blooded native american indian, two generations later, my brothers and sisters have had most of the american indian "washed out" of our appearance, but you can still see it if you're looking for it.

This would mean that you're one quarter Red Indian. You're probably right that this is evident in your phenotype if this is so. But is the fact that you're one quarter Red Indian and that you only have an incipient appearance of it meant to be contrary to my argument? If anything, I think that this lends credence to it.

Listen Crackbone, I'm probably doing a disservice to this site by prolonging this debate since its off topic, but like I said, there are no "distinct" races in the sense of distinct, rigid categories. This is a totally human and arbitrary distinction. Which is why I compared it to the spectrum of colors. Sure theres a distinct black color and a distinct white color at the extreme ends of the spectrum, but you could slice all the other colors up into a thousand different colors in between the spectrum, and infinite numbers of shadings. ANd these racial categories are much the same. You could arbitrary slice it up to four distinct races, or you could slice it into 400 distinct races. Its just a human projection.

What proof, other than your opinion do you have that when the babies mature the white one will look blacker or isn't it just as likely that the black one could look whiter? Here in the Bay Area, one of the star high school basketball players was Jason Kidd: same deal, black father, white mother; and he looks about 90% white. I don't think your theory holds water. It could go either way.

Blends between blacks and whites almost exclusively resemble their black parent. But you must remember that many of those who describe themselves as black really are quite mixed themselves, typically with whites. But when the child of a black and white parent less resembles his black parent, he usually doesn't have a white phenotype, really. It's just that he appears less black.

CrackBone....I think you just made the point for me. If people are Black and are being counted as White because they consider themselves White, then that would affect the size of the Black Population in Mexico wouldn't it? It would likewise affect the White Population as well, wouldn't it? Therefore, the population demographics of Mexico may be total hogwash, because based upon your theory, they are in a world all to their own as to whether or not they are Black Mexicans or White Mexicans.

It matters not to me how many of either one they have except that it wreaks of something unusual, unique, if not bizarre that a nation involved with slave trading for hundreds of years ended up with virtually no Black Citizens.

If Black Citizens consider themselves White, why would they? Unless, they felt so uncomfortable about being Black due to the level of racism in Mexico, they find it in their best interest to be White instead of Black.

As always, in discussing almost anything regarding Mexico....there are quandries, questions, pecularities, actions, practices, positions, goals and agendas of Mexico.....that just plain boggle this American Mind.

Therefore, I believe it warrants an international probe to find out what is going on there, something you learn from their history as well as current pratices. They've been in the news round the world twice in the last 4 weeks for outrageous racial comments and actions towards Blacks....and arrogantly refuse to apologize to the two American Reverends who flew down to Mex City special for it. These are the same people who turn around and accuse our Minute Men through their 501 C 3 Partners, WRONGFULLY, of being white supremacists racists.

This is irony and hypocrisy...in my view on the part of Mexico and I would still like to know What Happened to the Blacks in Mexico.

If you do not wonder what happened to them or feel they are all acounted for by the "breed out", then that's okay too.

No problemo!!