Fox Republican debate thread 6 pm Pacific

[Bren4824]

(quote)


Thursday, January 10, 2008
Tonight's Debate
Posted by: Hugh Hewitt at 10:11 PM
UPDATE: John McCain with Sean Hannity immediately after the debate compounds his error on immigration by giving the impression that the only change needed in McCain-Kennedy is border-security first. Wow. He just doesn't get it.

Romney followed McCain and by contrast shined, and spent time talking about the Reagn example and inspiration and the Reagan-Bush legacy. Romney also got the opportunity to talk to Michigan voters. "I continue to feel that you cannot write off jobs," he replied to Sean's question about McCain's "straight-talk" about Michigan's economic woes, and spoke specifically to the auto industry's renewal in Michigan. Assuming that conservatives watching the debate stuck around for 20 minutes, Romney did himself a great deal of good in the after-game.

ORIGINAL POST

Fred had a great night, Mitt a good one and Rudy did fine as well.

Senator McCain struggled, especially on the question of what to do if recession arrives, when he channeled Herbert Hoover and spoke only about cutting spending. His talk of global warming was a bright red flag to conservatives, and his repeating of his "change" answer from Sunday night --that he helped change the policy in Iraq-- underscored the impression that he was running through some talking points he understands to be safe. "Not for profit, but for patriotism" was another example of a recycled rhetoric from Sunday. His answer on deferring to captains-at-sea was a strong point, but that was the only one. His halting and often rambling answers and occasional grimaces and winks just don't work on television, and his immigration answers just don't fly. He has had three sub-par debate performances in a row.

The huge loser tonight was Mike Huckabee, thanks largely to Fred and Chris Wallace who peeled the bark off of Huck's ideology. Huck bristled at Wallace at one point, and when pushed on why he raised taxes and spending, barked back, "I raised expectations." That might work with Democrats --though it probably doesn't in this day and age-- but it sure doesn't work with Republican voters. Huck's whining about the religion question was also off-putting coming from a candidate who has so often injected religion into this campaign.

Romney had less screen time tonight, but each time he answered he was poised and eloquent. The opening response on the economy, aimed specifically at Michigan voters was very strong, and his "Nope" answer to Wallace's question about whether the voters in New Hampshire might be saying that they do not want change in D.C. was perfect pitch, and his grasp of the foreign affairs questions impressive. The fact that the debate ended on immigration helped him as well as it again underscores that John McCain still doesn't grasp or won't admit that the McCain-Kennedy bill was the problem throughout 2005 and 2006, not the fact that "Americans need to restore their trust in the government." The specifics of the McCain bill is what soured the debate, and McCain's absolute refusal to concede this renders his conversion on border security completely suspect.

Mitt, Fred and Rudy have generally done well in these settings since they began at the Reagan Library last year, McCain wasn't a factor until recently and he has struggled to get through them, and while Huckabee used the early debates to charm folks, his performance has plummeted as focus on his record has increased. There's a huge message in the last three debates about the issue differences between the candidates on taxes and immigration, with Giuliani, Romney and Thompson on one side and Huckabee and McCain on the other side. And there's a message about who can win these contests in the fall, and it isn't Senator McCain or Governor Huckabee.

(quote)

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog

Matthew 5:44

Great post. However, we always get it-----but for some reason, these voters are not getting it!!!!

[Populist]

Here is why Mitt Romney keeps mentioning the one gold and two silver. Check out the primary vote totals at the top of page.

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog

http://www.redstate.com/blogs/thunder/2 ... nomination

Race At A Glance
Total Primary Votes: Romney McCain Huckabee Giuliani Thompson
Iowa 29,494 15,559 40,841 4,097 15,904
New Hampshire 75,202 88,447 26,760 20,387 2,884

Total 104,696 104,006 67,601 24,484 18,788
Total Delegates: 30 10 21 1 6

Matthew 5:44

I saw that the MSNBC count of delegates has Huckabee ahead at this time, but CNNs tally and page that Hewitt is basing the above on seems quite thorough.

[GeorgiaPeach]

I am putting several articles here for us to learn more and to have some information for any comments that we may want to leave at any sites to oppose Mike Huckabee and to oppose John McCain.

(quote)


Key excerpts from the Santorum interview on McCain's immigration views:



HH: Senator, welcome back. I was just…did you serve alongside Senator McCain for 12 years or longer?

RS: 12 years.

HH: So you know him well.

RS: I do.

HH: When you hear the media talking about him, and of course, he got Iraq right, and we’re all grateful for that, but he wasn’t the only Republican to get it right. Do you believe he’s sincerely changed on the immigration bill to where he understands the message that was delivered last summer?

RS: No.

HH: Why not?

RS: Well, I mean, because John McCain was the leader on the other side of the aisle. John McCain was the guy who was working with Ted Kennedy to drive it down our throats, and lectured us repeatedly about how xenophobic we were, lectured us, us being the Republican conference, about how wrong we were on this, how we were on the wrong side of history, and that you know, this is important for his…because having come from Arizona, knowing the strength of the Hispanic community, that we were going to be seen as racists, and he wasn’t going be part of that, that he was not a racist, and that if we were for tougher borders, it was a racist thing. Look, John McCain looks at things through the eyes, on these kind of domestic policy issues, looks at it through the eyes of the New York Times editorial board, and accepts that predisposition that if you are not, if you stand for conservative principles, there’s some genetic defect.


Santorum on McCain's ideology generally:

HH: Why can’t John McCain win this election?

RS: Well, number one, John McCain will not get the base of the Republican Party. I mean, there was a reason John McCain collapsed last year, and it’s because he was the frontrunner, and everybody in the Republican Party got a chance to look at him. And when they looked at him, they wait well, wait a minute, he’s not with us on almost all of the core issues of…on the economic side, he was against the President’s tax cuts, he was bad on immigration. On the environment, he’s absolutely terrible. He buys into the complete left wing environmentalist movement in this country. He is for bigger government on a whole laundry list of issues. He was…I mean, on medical care, I mean, he was for re-importation of drugs. I mean, you can go on down the list. I mean, this is a guy who on a lot of the core economic issues, is not even close to being a moderate, in my opinion. And then on the issue of, on social conservative issues, you point to me one time John McCain every took the floor of the United States Senate to talk about a social conservative issue. It never happened. I mean, this is a guy who says he believes in these things, but I can tell you, inside the room, when we were in these meetings, there was nobody who fought harder not to have these votes before the United States Senate on some of the most important social conservative issues, whether it’s marriage or abortion or the like. He always fought against us to even bring them up, because he was uncomfortable voting for them. So I mean, this is just not a guy I think in the end that washes with the mainstream of the Republican Party.

(quote) clip

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog

Matthew 5:44

[stealthwii]

Best Ron Paul clip of the night (perhaps any debate) In my opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mffpkCH-PJw

To those who have always been republican, and perhaps are older and remember what republicans used to stand for - I think you will appreciate his response.

I still cant believe how honest and courageous Ron Paul is, whether you agree with him or not, he has balls, and he is making the republican party take a good hard look at themselves - something they need badly. Something our entire political system needs badly

[BearFlagRepublic]

OK, I watched it again. What Thompson actually said was "enforcement by attrition." Hey, he had the right idea. And for the record, he was the best on immigration tonight. He was the only one I believe who talked about employment verification. He said that our immigration policy should be "high walls, and long bridges." The moderator said that Romney said illegals should be looked at by a case by case basis (not sure if Romney actually said this). Thompson flattly rejected this idea. Paul brought it back to the economy again, saying that the tough economic times have made immigrants and especially illegals a source of anger -- he stopped short of the "scapegoat" comment this time. But, to his credit, he did say "the law is the law, and it needs to be enforced." Knucklehead made some stupid comment about how, "nobody should be looked at as illegal in this country, we should all be looked at as legal."

[Bren4824]

OK, I watched it again. What Thompson actually said was "enforcement by attrition." Hey, he had the right idea. And for the record, he was the best on immigration tonight. He was the only one I believe who talked about employment verification. He said that our immigration policy should be "high walls, and long bridges." The moderator said that Romney said illegals should be looked at by a case by case basis (not sure if Romney actually said this). Thompson flattly rejected this idea. Paul brought it back to the economy again, saying that the tough economic times have made immigrants and especially illegals a source of anger -- he stopped short of the "scapegoat" comment this time. But, to his credit, he did say "the law is the law, and it needs to be enforced." Knucklehead made some stupid comment about how, "nobody should be looked at as illegal in this country, we should all be looked at as legal."

"The moderator said that Romney said illegals should be looked at by a case by case basis (not sure if Romney actually said this."

Romney NO WAY said this..........It was Juan McAmnesty, when he was talking about the military man that was married to the illegal woman who was being deported!!!

You are right though-----the moderator referred to McCain as "governor", instead of "senator".

[agrneydgrl]

Well, I just changed my mind about Romney. He didn't have to make a joke out of Ron Paul. Romney is a jerk! And I just found that out.

Did you catch that RP was accusing our govt of maybe staging
that whole Iranian boat mess?

How do you think that sounds to most of America?

did you read the paper today/. Huge story on the fabrication of that. After all the immigration lies our government has fed us how can you
believe any of it.

If you would have listened to RP, he said "if you read the paper it said} and he repeated what they said about the fabrication.

[BearFlagRepublic]

"The moderator said that Romney said illegals should be looked at by a case by case basis (not sure if Romney actually said this."

Romney NO WAY said this..........It was Juan McAmnesty, when he was talking about the military man that was married to the illegal woman who was being deported!!!

You are right though-----the moderator referred to McCain as "governor", instead of "senator".

Ah, that explains it. When he said "governor," I assumed he meant Romney -- he incorrectly referenced McShame, good catch.

I thought it was funny that Romney said that all of the candidates wanted the border enforced, except Paul, because he did not know his position. In all honesty, I can't blame Mitt. Paul has been really quiet about the issue, and somewhat ambiguous.

[tinybobidaho]

BearFlag, Ron paul hasn't been quiet on his views on illegal immigration. He has a tv ad running about it. It's available on YouTube.

[BearFlagRepublic]

BearFlag, Ron paul hasn't been quiet on his views on illegal immigration. He has a tv ad running about it. It's available on YouTube.

I meant in the debates. Romney didn't know Paul's views, because he has not weighed in as much as the others in the debates.