Thread: I OPPOSE illegals from coming – NEUTRAL on the ones here

I would also like to request that everyone in this discussion make a decided effort to stick to the ALIPAC rules and to raise the level of debate please.

A lot of you are strong fighters but you can make your points without insults.

W

Cassie, I appreciate your opinion on this, but you have apparently overlooked something. Illegal aliens are coming up here to escape the living conditions in their own countries. By the way, is Mexico's poverty rate still at 59% or has it gone up? Anyway, they have lived under a moderately oppressive government for a long time. They come here and they have no idea of how this government works. Special interest groups come up to them and say that they can get them things if they will just do as we say. So they go out and protest for immigration reform "amnesty" as well as protesting local and state ordinances against illegal immigration. If they get amnesty, they will be a problematic voting block.
These special interest groups have their own agenda, like Laraza and MechA. What they're not realizing is that our government has its agenda. This agenda is the SPP and the NAU. President Bush, and the globalists involved in this act of high treason, knows that they need the illegal immigrants to become US citizens so they can help thwart the loyal Americans who are standing in the way. This reminds me of a tv show I used to watch: Star Trek the Next Generation. In it the Romulans plan to invade Vulcan under the guise of a peace accord.For those of you who never watched the show, Vulcans and Romulans are identical in appearance. The officer in charge of the invasion says that once they are on the planet, they will blend in and be impossible to distinguish from the other Vulcans. She said that unification will become a fact of life. This remind you of how the police are being accused of racial profiling and how local ordinances are being blocked because of potential discrimination against legal residents?
The key is that no quarter can be given on this issue without inadvertently supporting the SPP. None can be given amnesty or be allowed to stay.

Originally Posted by cassie

Originally Posted by ALIPAC

Cassie,

Please understand that CrocketsGhost has recently endured a case of trollitis and we expect his mood to improve a great deal in the near future.

Didn't Hillary Clinton try to sound tough on illegal immigration about a year ago?

They love Hillary on the Gilmore Girls Show, but then again there appears to be no illegal aliens in Stars Hollow yet.

W

And I hope this too, that his mood will improve. We have a country to save, and no time to fight among each other. I will ignore Crocket for some time, and then he'll figure out all by himself that he was wrong labelling me. I know I can lose my temper within a second. It's wrong, but that's me.

Alipac do you know that most Democratic voters also oppose illegal immigration. If 80% of our pop. oppose illegals, we know it can't be just the Republicans. I also oppose illegals, because I'm against people breaking the law. Hillary is soft on illegals, I know that. But I just can't vote a Republican ( 3rd party not an option ). Going to war based on lies is so morally wrong to me, that I won't even consider voting for Republican. All I can hope for is a Democratic president that will enforce our existing immigration laws, build the fence, etc. Republicans are soft on illegal immigration too, btw.

Yes, Bush is a liar... but the lies in the air are thick and the real power that is telling these lies goes past Dem or Rep.

Yes, Americans are against the Iraq War and it now stands as another example of how the citizens of America are being lied to and no longer have control of our own government.

Anyone trying to think about this fight in strict terms of Dems and Reps will not be able to operate.

Cassie, please take a close look at the populist Republicans in Tancredo's immigration reform caucus.

These brave men and women in Congress are the only political foot in the door we have had over the last four years. Most of them are Reps.

Everyone on our boards here at ALIPAC needs to realize that these boards are open to anyone that shares our cause and supports the ALIPAC platform with the exceptions being any group motivated primarily by race issues.

The rules we have in place are designed to assure that happens.

W

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

What do you do ??

1 ) deport all those cats, but leave the door open, and don’t clean up the milk & beef

Or

2 ) first you close the door to prevent more cats from coming, then clean the milk & beef and after that start deporting all those cats. Or decide to keep a few cats when you know they're homeless.

First, it seems that there are some presumptions to your premise, and it does not constitute a very accurate analogy nor does it recognize all the options.

However, in this scenario, I would get a broom and run all the invading varmints out of the house with sufficient gusto that they were unlikely to ever try to return. I would then slam the door behind them and make sure I was never this careless again. More importantly, I would fire the maid (the analogue being the government officials whose bad policies failed to prevent this situation) for her failing in leaving spilled milk and beef on the floor and not closing the door to keep wandering animals from invading my home.

I was going to say the same thing. Swat and shoo all the cats out of the house. Shut the door so no more come in. DESINFECT the entire house to make sure diseases and weird germs don't spread all over the place. Then I would call the 'animal control' people and make a report that stray, illegal, and un-neutured cats are roaming freely all over the neighborhood.
How can you say you are against illegal immigration, but are "neutral" on the ones already here. That's nuts.

Originally Posted by cassie

Originally Posted by Hosay

Cassie,

In your replies like "Prove it" to what I said, you are similar to the way I used to be. First, you have to realize that I grew up in and continue to live in areas with a large Hispanic population, so I am totally familiar with Hispanics from various nations and who is legal and who is not.

So when I saw the Hispanic male and his son drive up in a car and I saw the person whom I specifically know to be an illegal day laborer approach the car, but they did not want to pick him up at the housing complex because there were people around such as myself- I knew what I was seeing. That day laborer lives in the same housing complex as I do. I have seen him many times. As luck would have it, when I got to the 7-11, I saw that car parked in front, and the man and his son get out of it. Then I saw the day laborer arrive and wait by the car in a submissive posture while the man and his son were in the 7-11. He looked happy to be getting the day job. I'll stop the story there.

Second, here is the way I used to be. I saw some Hispanic kids stealing a bike and then I saws some the police chasing them and catching one kid with a whole bag of tools (i.e. bike theft tools), and I saw one kid hide the bike they stole in an alley behind a garbage bin. But I still, for a whole ten minutes, was thinking to myself, "Just because they are Hispanic, why are these police assuming that they were stealing the bike?" Then I came to my senses and told the police that I knew where they had stashed the bike. You understand, I was refusing to acknowledge the reality I was seeing with my own eyes.

So I think by saying "prove it" you are just wrong. My suspicions are well-founded and almost always correct, especially since I started to acknowledge the reality I was seeing with my own eyes.

It's like what they said in the movie Minority Report: Obre Los Oyos. Sorry for the misspelling.
Oops that was Vanilla Sky.

Thank you for sharing your story. I live in the illegal immigration state, and I assume a lot of things too, but it’s just wrong to do so. We can’t generalize people. My husband and I ( + kids ) are moving to Georgia by the end of this year probably. I like to go to Georgia, they don’t have that problem with illegal aliens, It’s far from the border, and the people are said to be nice and laid back. But my final destination will always be California, this is were I was born, raised and spend my whole life. This is my state, and my state is worth fighting for.

It was definitely, with no assumptions or suspicions, a case of one Hispanic hiring another Hispanic who is illegally present in this country.

There was also a case reported in the news and on this board of a Chinese restaurant where the owner was hiring illegal Chinese immigrants. I think the owner of the restaurant was here illegally too.

Then there was the case reported in the news where a state trooper apprehended 4 illegal immigrants at a traffic stop, and then their employer heard about it and he went by the police station to check on his employees and support them, and the employer turned out to be an illegal immigrant.

Point is, they hire their own and if we let the current batch of illegal immigrants stay, there will be a massive lobby for totally open borders. Enforcement could become politically impossible, and then we are on our way to a North American Union and a Southwest that may push for some kind of closer union with Mexico.

Originally Posted by Qflash

Cassie, I appreciate your opinion on this, but you have apparently overlooked something. Illegal aliens are coming up here to escape the living conditions in their own countries. By the way, is Mexico's poverty rate still at 59% or has it gone up? Anyway, they have lived under a moderately oppressive government for a long time. They come here and they have no idea of how this government works. Special interest groups come up to them and say that they can get them things if they will just do as we say. So they go out and protest for immigration reform "amnesty" as well as protesting local and state ordinances against illegal immigration. If they get amnesty, they will be a problematic voting block.

Oops, I totally lost track of this thread I started myself
I know why illegal aliens are coming to this country and also understand that most illegals are victims to of globalization. There're many, many illegal aliens her in California, we and Texas take the burden of all those illegals crossing the border. Other states 1,000 mi from here are almost illegal free, but here they're everywhere. Sac is 520 mi from the border but there're many illegals here. Most of them look Indian tribe and I read an article that 25% of Mexicans make only $ 2 a day. TWO Dollars !! The poor in Mexico are mainly those Indians and those are the ones coming. They're being left alone by the corrupt Mexican government, and I really feel sorry for those Mexican Indians that crossed our borders. It's not really their fault too, and that's why I think that we must close the border, no benefits to illegals, announcement on tv that any illegal being in the country after a set date will face 5 years prison, and also jail employers. Most illegals will self deport, but the illegals that make only $ 2 back in Mexico, wil probably stay because they have nothing to lose and they will stay anyway. Anf for those people I have the opinion that I'm neutral, and maybe we should give them a worker's permit or deport them. But here is my mixed feeling, my heart and brains are in conflict here.

These special interest groups have their own agenda, like Laraza and MechA. What they're not realizing is that our government has its agenda. This agenda is the SPP and the NAU.

La Raza, Maldef, Lulac, Naacp, Mecha, etc are all race racketeers.
But they don't represent all Mexicans or minorities.

Originally Posted by ALIPAC

Yes, Bush is a liar... but the lies in the air are thick and the real power that is telling these lies goes past Dem or Rep. Yes, Americans are against the Iraq War and it now stands as another example of how the citizens of America are being lied to and no longer have control of our own government. Anyone trying to think about this fight in strict terms of Dems and Reps will not be able to operate.

Many, if not all, politicians are corrupt selfish liars and we need to elect the least of all evils. We have been lied to about Iraq, but also on illegal immigration. What I don't understand is that 4,400 Americans die every year by the hands of illegals, that's more than 20,000 since 911.

We lost in Iraq + Afghanistan less than 4,000 service personnel. Most Americans, including me, are more concerned about the war. Why ?? I don't know. I will consider, and probably carry out, protesting illegals in SF or Castro Valley, but it can be this month or next month. But when there would be an anti war rally in one of those 2 cities, I'd jump into my car right away. I don't know why, Bluejersey said it right. He's an OBL yet he was right that the anti war lobby can mobilize more people than the minuteman, we can mobilize more people that will make those illegal marches on labor day look like peanuts.

Cassie, please take a close look at the populist Republicans in Tancredo's immigration reform caucus.These brave men and women in Congress are the only political foot in the door we have had over the last four years. Most of them are Reps.

I know that Tancredo is a patriot ans means well. If I'd vote outside the Democratic party, I'll vote for Patrick Buchanan. Don't think he's running for president. What I'm looking for is an honest candidate that will not lie to me. Al gore is a man of honor to me, Bush stole the 2000 elections, Gore could fight it in court but he cared about America and did what he thought what was right for the country and allowed Bush to take office. And Al Gore scores better on illegal imigration than McCain or Giuliani.

Originally Posted by Hosay

It was definitely, with no assumptions or suspicions, a case of one Hispanic hiring another Hispanic who is illegally present in this country.

I wasn't there and can't judge it, I just adviced you not to generalize people.

There was also a case reported in the news and on this board of a Chinese restaurant where the owner was hiring illegal Chinese immigrants. I think the owner of the restaurant was here illegally too.

How can an illegal open a restaurant ?? The restaurant owner gets paid, he needs a SS number, how can he start business without SS ?
Illegals get paid under the table, but a restaurant is there, it's visible. You can see it standing there, how could this happen ?

Then there was the case reported in the news where a state trooper apprehended 4 illegal immigrants at a traffic stop, and then their employer heard about it and he went by the police station to check on his employees and support them, and the employer turned out to be an illegal immigrant.

Point is, they hire their own and if we let the current batch of illegal immigrants stay, there will be a massive lobby for totally open borders. Enforcement could become politically impossible, and then we are on our way to a North American Union and a Southwest that may push for some kind of closer union with Mexico.

That's why I keep saying build the wall first, deploy the national guard, strip illegals from benefits, jail employers, etc
Most will sefl deport, the few that will stay here will be subject to discussion: deportation or amnesty

Originally Posted by firecracker

How can you say you are against illegal immigration, but are "neutral" on the ones already here. That's nuts.

Read my post, Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:48 pm ( PST )

Cassie, you say your nuetral on the illegals already hear. What about the thousands more that will be here tomorrow, and the next day, and on? Where does it end ? What`s your limit?

Originally Posted by mkfarnam

Cassie, you say your nuetral on the illegals already hear. What about the thousands more that will be here tomorrow, and the next day, and on? Where does it end ? What`s your limit?

No, I suggested to close the borders asap. We can have deployed 100,000 national guard personnel by Monday. border is closed, nobody gets in. Then we can strip illegals from their benefits, fine or jail employers, and announcement on TV that any illegal in the country after Feb 28th faces 5 years in prison. These measurements will maker sure that illegals will self deport, and hardly to no illegals get in because of those 100,000 national guard personnel. The few illegals, the world's most poor, will be subjected to discussion.